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Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:00 pm
by Hourhouse
The photo shows a train of happy holidaymakers heading for Scarborough, but the loco is a bit of a mongrel.
I suspect a complete fabrication by a skilful artist, but in places, it looks like a photo and that has to be a North Eastern cab. Any thoughts?

Now identified by the excellent Wainwright as a L&Y Dreadnought! Many thanks.
51433307_2006322306339206_4653134892375212032_o.jpg

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:03 pm
by jwealleans
Sticking my neck out, but isn't that an LMS Claughton, or something similar?

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:46 pm
by Wainwright
That, sir, looks like an L&YR Dreadnought.

https://transportsofdelight.smugmug.com ... i-8tC3Gj2/

THis tiled map (from Manchester Victoria I think) shows that the L&YR advertised itself as having running rights over the Scarborough line (and it certainly ran trains into York).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lancashir ... tation.jpg

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:58 pm
by Hourhouse
Blimey, that was quick!
Yes, it's certainly a Dreadnought. That's a new one on me - always learning :D
Many thanks for the help.

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:43 pm
by jwealleans
There you go. What he said.

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:14 pm
by 50C
The last one (50455) of Blackpool shed(24E) was withdrawn in October 1951.

50c

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:31 pm
by Wainwright
More about these near-miss designs here...

http://www.lyrs.org.uk/images/uploads/P ... o_1932.pdf

NB I read in Harold Holcroft's memoirs that the Southern staff made a study of these Hughes 4 cylinder 4-6-0s (as well as the Raven Pacifics and the GWR 4-cylinder types) at the research stage for designing the Lord Nelsons...

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:33 pm
by Wainwright
Back to the more general point about LYR workings into Scarborough - does anyone know was it ever possible to see the earlier Aspinall 4-4-2s alongside NER 4-4-2s at Scarborough before WWI?

(Particularly interested in the Worsdell/Smith Compound 4-4-2s which have some external vague resemblance to the Aspinall types if you squint through mist).

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 10:55 pm
by Blink Bonny
Ay up!

The Dreadnought is also drawing a rake of suspiciously L&Y/LMS stock.

There was a similar series in the 20s and 30s showing a certain 4472 arriving at Scarborough, Blackpool, Brighton and all sorts of similar places.....

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:10 pm
by Wainwright
Ah, thanks, Mr BB.

Googling a bit shows up the L&Y 4-6-0 'arriving' at Bridlington, and an LSWR 'paddlebox' / T14 which seeming a surprisingly large amount of time in Scotland.

http://www.edinphoto.org.uk/0_pcv_unide ... tiview.htm

So did Lancs and Yorks locos never really penetrate to Scarborough at all? Shame.

Re: Mystery mongrel Locomotive

Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:39 am
by billbedford
Wainwright wrote:
Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:10 pm
So did Lancs and Yorks locos never really penetrate to Scarborough at all? Shame.
More than likely. Summer excursions tended to take on pilotmen rather than change engines when they went into foreign territory, and L&Y men would have been signed to York anyway. The same was true for major sporting events e.g Aintree.