New B17 Thread

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redtoon1892
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Post by redtoon1892 »

B17 Footballers
Sunderland had their nameplate over the players tunnel at the old Roker Park, dont know what happened to it when they moved to the Stadium of Light
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Post by x568wcn »

Don't know what it's doing in A4s, but found a link about the Darkiungton plate in 2004 http://www.ghostships.co.uk/the_north_e ... /ad93.html
http://www.theclarion.co.uk/the_north_e ... /ad33.html

As for the sunderland plate at the Stadium of light, it doesn't look to be over the tunnel http://www.bbc.co.uk/wear/content/panor ... _360.shtml
My manager is from Chester-Le-Street, and supports Sunderland, (yes he is THE fan!) I'll ask him on monday to confirm.

Name plates are a bit odd really, there are usually 2.
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redtoon1892
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Post by redtoon1892 »

The old roker Park is where the nameplate was not the Stadium of Light
in fact I have a pic somewhere of Charley Hurly emerging from the tunnel and the plate can be seen in the background
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Post by x568wcn »

yes, but it isn't at the SOL, so the question is, where it be now?

Sunderland took the 1938 team to the FA cup final BTW
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Sunderland

Post by 52D »

Sunderland the loco took the players to a fine victory in 1937 see attached FTM.
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Post by Bullhead »

Judging by the look of the bloke on the platform, he's a Magpies fan.
So - did anyone dare tell Stephenson, "It's not Rocket science"?
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Post by richard »

I split the old A4 thread, so that the B17 posts have their own thread: ie. this one.

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B17 Sunderland

Post by 52D »

See above picture download. Where was Sunderland shedded at the time.
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Post by silver fox »

Don't have 1923-1948, only First day Last day and BR 1948 - 1968

On the last day it was at Cambridge, then in BR it was at stratford in 52 & 55, and Norwich in 59, withdrawn 11/59
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Post by Cuddie Headrigg »

Bullhead wrote:Judging by the look of the bloke on the platform, he's a Magpies fan.
Possibly because he knew it was really 2851 "Derby County".

No. 2854 "Sunderland" was rostered on one of the trains for Sunderland's appearence in the 1937 Cup Final. It was in works at the time, so the nameplates were transferred to No. 2851 "Derby County" and temporarily renumbered on 17th April 1937 at Gorton MPD and kept them till 9th May 1937 when the status quo was resumed.
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Post by redtoon1892 »

Well this isnt it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by Cuddie Headrigg »

redtoon1892 wrote:Well this isnt it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yep ... nothing like Status Quo!
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Post by redtoon1892 »

An interesting theory from the "Northern Echo"

Gunner suspected in Magpies mystery
From the Northern Echo, first published Monday 24th Jan 2005.

TRAINS of thought and all that, the column a couple of weeks back noted that pre-war LNER steam engines were named after Sunderland, Middlesbrough and even Darlington football clubs but not, curiously, after Newcastle United.

We were mistaken. Now it becomes curiouser and curiouser.

Proudly named Newcastle United, handsome new nameplate proclaiming in black and white its allegiance, class B17 No. 2858 left the North Road workshops in Darlington on May 28 1936.

Ten days later, 2858 had got as far as a railway exhibition in Romford. The "Newcastle United" nameplate had disappeared in a vapid hiss of steam, the least enduring naming in railway history.

Instead the engine had become The Essex Regiment, the Newcastle United nameplates never officially to be seen again. The finger of suspicion pointed at the Arsenal.

For putting the column on the right lines - though there is to be another departure yet - we are grateful to Jimmy McKinney in Merryoaks, Durham, and to his work colleague Colin Bell, known as Griver for reasons which doubtless can be spotted.

Gricer's a Sunderland fan. "He disagrees with your account, though he wishes it were true, " says Jimmy, who also encloses a copy of the December 2002 issue of Railway Magazine, which tells the whole sad story.

The London and North Eastern Railway originally allocated "football club" names to 14 B17s, at once provoking cries of "Foul" and "How, Ref" and similar imprecations from those railway towns who'd missed the connection.

"The locomotive names were subject to almost as many transfers as the clubs' players, " noted Railway magazine, and no more skullduggery than at North Road shops, where Sheffield Wednesday - then in the first division ? suddenly became Darlington, of the Third North.

Other notable omissions from LNER territory were York City and Ipswich Town. "Clearly, " said Railway Magazine in 2002, "the staff at York works didn't have the same clout as their Darlington colleagues." Sunderland also came close to derailment, the loco of that name under repair when the team reached the 1937 FA Cup final.

Nameplates were swapped with Derby County; "Sunderland" hauled the train to Wembley.

Long treasured by the Quakers, the "Darlington" nameplate was sold when times were hard last year. Though the club won't reveal a figure, the market price is reckoned around £25,000.

None of the train spotters' manuals included Newcastle United, sidelined for 65 years until Magpies' fan David Tyreman - one of the Northallerton Tyremen and 40 years a railwayman - decided to restore the club's good name.

David, who now lives in the city, is also North-East branch chairman of the Railway Correspondence and Travel Society.

"My theory is that one of the LNER directors was an Arsenal fan, " he says.

"We'd beaten Arsenal in the 1932 FA Cup final, the allegation that our equaliser came from a cross that was over the line before the lad hit it.

"They never forgave us, but it was a very dirty trick. So far as I can gather, the United nameplates just went for scrap." David, dismayed, paid more than £500 from his own pocket for a replica, which in January 2003 the Magpies gratefully and ceremonially accepted.

Though it still hangs in the main foyer, the club has flat refused the column permission to photograph the benefactor - or any other living soul - alongside it.

It is yet another chapter in the great Newcastle United mystery, yet another obfuscation. Wheels within wheels, as probably they say on the railways.

The February 2005 Railway Magazine includes a splendid montage of "Newcastle United" with the Tyne Bridge in the background and two Magpies - for joy, what else - above the nameplate.

It's produced by Ian Wright Cards of Burnley, but since no photographs of the Toon nameplate are available, Newcastle are based on Norwich City.

Ian began four years ago by selling prints of the "Football club" locos, demand so great that he now does everything from umbrellas to fridge magnets and much else in between.

Details from Ian at 134 Casterton Avenue, Burnley BB10 2PE, email babs@barbarahunt. fsnet. co. uk
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Post by giner »

That is indeed a fascinating article, redtoon1892. Thanks for that, but as an Arsenal fan myself I couldn't help but chuckle at the irony of someone who's a namesake of Arsenal legend Ian Wright being involved in this saga. :D:D
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