Southend 2-6-4

This forum is for the discussion of the locomotives, motive power, and rolling stock of the LNER and its constituent companies.

Moderators: 52D, Tom F, Rlangham, Atlantic 3279, Blink Bonny, Saint Johnstoun, richard

Post Reply
Lexy
NER Y7 0-4-0T
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2022 8:25 am

Southend 2-6-4

Post by Lexy »

Hi, I was wondering if anybody on here knows if drawings exist of Gresleys planned 2-6-4 for Southend services that got cancelled?
It’s been on my mind a lot lately.

Thanks.
User avatar
Atlantic 3279
LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
Posts: 6527
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:51 am
Location: 2850, 245

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

I believe there's a side elevation drawing of the proposal in part 10A of the RCTS series of books on Locomotives of the LNER.
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1

Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
Hatfield Shed
LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
Posts: 1664
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 3:34 pm

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by Hatfield Shed »

Seen a model based on the proposal outline drawing, probably constructed by 'someone' at the one time WGC MRC (early 1970s). At this distance I don't recall much in the way of detail, but it looked like a credible loco..
Darryl Tooley
NBR J36 0-6-0
Posts: 106
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 9:21 pm
Location: Briston, UK

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by Darryl Tooley »

Atlantic 3279 wrote: Fri Jul 22, 2022 4:19 pm I believe there's a side elevation drawing of the proposal in part 10A of the RCTS series of books on Locomotives of the LNER.
Not that I can see. There is, however, one on p46 of LNER Locomotive Development by J Armstrong (Peco,1974).

D
User avatar
Atlantic 3279
LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
Posts: 6527
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:51 am
Location: 2850, 245

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Sorry, my mistake, wrong volume, although as the loco was never built it should arguably have appeared in 10A.

It actually features in the preamble to Thompson's L1 class in the RCTS vol 9A. See page 14 drawings and read notes on page 12 for guidance, as both the 1925 Doncaster scheme for an enlarged suburban tank engine and the 1927 Stratford scheme for a loco for the Southend line are shown.
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1

Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
Hatfield Shed
LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
Posts: 1664
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 3:34 pm

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by Hatfield Shed »

Darryl Tooley wrote: Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:15 am ...There is, however, one on p46 of LNER Locomotive Development by J Armstrong ...
The necessary reminder. Just couldn't think of his name: he was a WGC resident, known for his LNER interest among enthusiasts in the locality.
Lexy
NER Y7 0-4-0T
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2022 8:25 am

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by Lexy »

Thank you for the responses!! Will look into these sources
JASd17
LNER A3 4-6-2
Posts: 1316
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2010 11:21 pm

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by JASd17 »

Darryl Tooley wrote: Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:15 am
Atlantic 3279 wrote: Fri Jul 22, 2022 4:19 pm I believe there's a side elevation drawing of the proposal in part 10A of the RCTS series of books on Locomotives of the LNER.
Not that I can see. There is, however, one on p46 of LNER Locomotive Development by J Armstrong (Peco,1974).

D
Darryl,

That may have been my first LNER book, followed by Peter Tatlow's LNER Wagons. Then LNER Album Volume 3 new.

I must have been doing some work, because pocket money would not have paid for those volumes.

Things have moved on, and Peter Tatlow will have a new series of books, on LNER Goods traffic, out soon I hope.

John
sturrock
LNER J94 0-6-0ST Austerity
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 3:13 am

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by sturrock »

Re the proposed 2 6 4 T Southend proposal, according to Jim Armstrong's book, and my understanding, it was not proceeded with after the "River" class of the S R difficulty in which a similar relatively large wheeled tank engine had with stability caused by harmonic imbalance of the necessarily high water tanks, probably exacerbated by poor track alignment (trials on the stable GNR mainline were subsequently done with fairly good results). The "Rivers" were all soon converted to 2 6 0 tender engines.
The 2 6 4 Southend tank would have been unusual if produced as Armstrong suggests as it would have been the only Gresley outside two cylinder locomotive since the GNR era K2 and O1.
A general arrangement drawing appears on page 46 together with text on P 44.
Hatfield Shed
LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
Posts: 1664
Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 3:34 pm

Re: Southend 2-6-4

Post by Hatfield Shed »

sturrock wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 2:34 am ...The 2-6 4 Southend tank would have been unusual if produced as Armstrong suggests as it would have been the only Gresley outside two cylinder locomotive since the GNR era K2 and O1...
My recollection is that this proposed 2-6-4T was only an outline scheme, and had several dubious features; leading the charge 6'2" driving wheels, when existing designs on 5'8" wheels were proven to have sufficient speed capability for this class of work. It would be interesting to know just how many significant variants and iterations of the 'larger' suburban service tank loco design were proposed, before the V1 design 'settled' in the form constructed.
Post Reply