Why right-hand drive on A1's?

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nicospilt
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Why right-hand drive on A1's?

Post by nicospilt » Sat Jan 28, 2006 12:57 pm

Why were the A1 Pacifics, and other engines like the Moghuls, initially fitted with right-hand drive? This doesn't seem logical to me, or was it that the GNR drove her trains on the right track?

By the way: who can tell me when 4472 visited San Francisco? Must have been in 1969 or 1970. Picture: http://www.nicospilt.com/RvdR19691970_227.JPG

Nico Spilt

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Colombo
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Post by Colombo » Sat Jan 28, 2006 1:32 pm

Nico,

The GNR conformed to UK practice and ran the trains on the LH track. The drivers traditionally drove from the RHS side of the cab, probably as that was the tradition with horse drawn traffic and subsequently motor cars. This situation continued until the boilers got so large that they could no longer see the signals beside the track from the RHS as they got closer to them.

It therefore became inevitable that a change would be made to L H Drive so that the drivers could have a better vantage point to see the signals properly.

This has always been my understanding, but if anyone knows better, please tell me.

Colombo

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x568wcn
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Post by x568wcn » Sat Jan 28, 2006 1:59 pm

28th September 1969 4472 was shipped out, and it was 1973 when it finally got back.
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richard
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Post by richard » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:01 pm

Nico: Flying Scotsman toured the US at the end of the 1960s. I've seen pictures on the web of it at Dallas Union Station - hard to imagine :-)

Ending at San Francisco, it hauled a short shuttle service along a dock line. I think would probably be 1971-ish. Then went into storage for most of 1972 without the money to return it home.

McAlpine bought it and returned it in 1973. After almost bankrupting every private owner its had, it is now in the National Collection. See the News section in these forums for the latest news and pictures regarding its current overhaul.

That is a good picture - I'm going to print it out for reference. I'm in the process of converting an N Gauge Flying Scotsman to be "Americanized". I still haven't sourced or worked out how to build the cow catcher.

Richard
Last edited by richard on Sat Jan 28, 2006 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bullhead
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Post by Bullhead » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:58 pm

Colombo wrote:Nico,

The GNR conformed to UK practice and ran the trains on the LH track. The drivers traditionally drove from the RHS side of the cab, probably as that was the tradition with horse drawn traffic and subsequently motor cars. This situation continued until the boilers got so large that they could no longer see the signals beside the track from the RHS as they got closer to them.

It therefore became inevitable that a change would be made to L H Drive so that the drivers could have a better vantage point to see the signals properly.

This has always been my understanding, but if anyone knows better, please tell me.

Colombo
That's my understanding too. Left-hand drive became standard - everywhere except Great Western :roll:.
So - did anyone dare tell Stephenson, "It's not Rocket science"?

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x568wcn
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Post by x568wcn » Sat Jan 28, 2006 4:36 pm

richard wrote:McAlpine bought it and returned it in 1973.
I know an architect here in York, John he's called ( I won't advertise for him, but he's a partner in his company)
I saw him Thursday (first time this year) and he'd been down to the museum and got in to the workshop, to take a photo of scotsman, (I don't know if it's for a photo, or a painting, as he also paints) but he's doing it for Sir William McAlpine's 70th Birthday, he's invited to the party (it's a weekend event!)

visit his site @ http://www.johnaives.co.uk/
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nicospilt
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Post by nicospilt » Sat Jan 28, 2006 10:01 pm

x568wcn wrote:28th September 1969 4472 was shipped out, and it was 1973 when it finally got back.
In my collection I found another photo of 4472. Made in April 1969 near Arley & Fillongley, with a special train from Birmingham to Lincoln. The picture was made by mr D.A. Swindell who lived at Overseal near Burton-on-Trent. More details are welcome! http://www.nicospilt.com/DAS19690400_4472.JPG

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x568wcn
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Post by x568wcn » Sat Jan 28, 2006 10:04 pm

I got it from the NRM Website

1963 16 April - Alan Pegler purchases Flying Scotsman and she begins a six year tour of the UK
1968 1 May - The 40th anniversary of non stop running is marked with a repeat run, reaching Edinburgh in 7¾ hours
1969 An American type headlamp, bell and whistle, cowcatcher and front buckeye coupling are fitted
1969 28 September - Flying Scotsman arrives in Boston, Massachusetts, USA for a tour of American cities and towns
1970 A second tour of America
1971 The locomotive participates in the Canadian National Exhibition and tour
1972 The locomotive hits a financial crisis and the first Save our Scotsman appeal is launched
1973 Bill McAlpine purchases the locomotive and it is shipped home. Flying Scotsman begins to tour the country pulling steam specials

http://www.nrm.org.uk/flyingscotsman/index.asp
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x568wcn
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Post by x568wcn » Sat Jan 28, 2006 10:08 pm

richard wrote: After almost bankrupting every private owner its had, it is now in the National Collection.
Richard
Apparently, DR Tony Marchington bought it, had her overhauled, which came to £750,000, oh dear he said, and had to launch Scotsman enterprises with a bunch of london businessmen, it was these who decided to sell her!
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Post by jdtoronto » Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:15 am

richard wrote: That is a good picture - I'm going to print it out for reference. I'm in the process of converting an N Gauge Flying Scotsman to be "Americanized". I still haven't sourced or worked out how to build the cow catcher.

Richard
Richard,

Victorian Railways (Australia) had cow-catchers on a number of classes, I recall seeing them on the R class Hudsons, J class and the S class Spirit of Progress pacifics in their streamlined bodies. In most of these the catcher was little more than a flat plate (sometimes with a crease in the centre), with cut slots mounted below the buffer beam. It is likely you could see them in the photos on the website I linked in the thread about 4472.

I suspect it might be easy to etch one from brass. THe MmicroMark etching kit is not hard to use!

John

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richard
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Post by richard » Sun Jan 29, 2006 4:37 pm

Yes I saw the etching kit. I seem to remember it wasn't cheap - I'll have another look. And how do I explain it to the Misses :-)




Richard
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