Tornado - Top Gear

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silver fox
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Tornado - Top Gear

Post by silver fox » Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:01 am

Did anyone else spot this? My Cousin did, and I disputed him until I found it.
At the point where they are leaving Berwick, you see the attached shot, and the question is, is this leaving York's Platform 11, passing the NRM?
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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by 52A » Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:59 am

Yes, continuity error!

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by Ferrybridge Flyer » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:20 am

Well spotted that man!!!Eagle-eyes or what!
Bring back Ferrybridge station!

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by Rambler » Tue Feb 02, 2010 1:01 pm

Is that the Brewick that is just south of the Scottish Border? :?

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by berwickspotter » Tue Feb 02, 2010 6:02 pm

Rambler wrote:Is that the Brewick that is just south of the Scottish Border? :?
Yes it is have a look at-
http://www.youtube.com/berwickspotter#p ... ZnO9dtlghQ

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by giner » Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:45 pm

Just a sidenote really, but what now marks the England/Scotland border? I know there used to be that rather grand sign in days gone by. I suspect that it's been reduced to something small and 'plain jane' by now. Anyone with a photo, please?

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by Trestrol » Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:48 pm

giner wrote:Just a sidenote really, but what now marks the England/Scotland border? I know there used to be that rather grand sign in days gone by. I suspect that it's been reduced to something small and 'plain jane' by now. Anyone with a photo, please?
It still is, if i remember correctly GNER(remember them?) paid to have the original restored/new copy made.

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by 52D » Tue Feb 02, 2010 10:39 pm

For those on the forum that are geographically challenged the Scottish border is crossed by the ECML about 3 miles North from Berwick at Lamberton Toll once renowned in a similar way to Gretna Green. The LNERs other England Scotland crossings had similar markers i think the one from Deadwater on the Border counties line is in the NRM the other crossings are at Carham on the Tweed Valley line and Kershopefoot on the Waverley. Out of shot there also was a cast divisional boundary marker with an E on one side and i think a Y on the other signifiying Edinburgh and York.
Were similar signs erected on the GCR where it crossed into Wales?.
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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by giner » Wed Feb 03, 2010 2:41 am

Thanks, gents. It's good to see something attractive is still in place. Don't know about the England/Wales border on the GCR, but the GWR would have had to have erected theirs in the middle of the Severn Tunnel and visible to nobody. Mind you, you could certainly feel the change in gradient at that point, and the loco up front which had sped into the tunnel on the drop from Little Somerford(?) would be labouring hard up the bank on the Welsh side.

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by Flamingo » Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:43 pm

The location just north of Berwick was known as Marshall Meadows I think.

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by 52A » Wed Feb 03, 2010 1:08 pm

Marshall Meadows is just over a mile south of the border.

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by 52D » Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:15 pm

52A wrote:Marshall Meadows is just over a mile south of the border.
The Political and geographical position of Berwick upon Tweed would take quite a bit of explaining so i will try to simplify things in a railway context.
Berwick changed hands between England & Scotland at least 14 times, when the final borders were drawn up there was a slice of the county of Northumberland roughly wedge shaped North of the Natural border the River Tweed that included the Town of Berwick.
The Railway in the shape of the NBR came with its first incursion into England to Berwick. The YN&BR (later NER) bridged the Tweed and had a Signalbox at the North end of the Royal Border Bridge this completed the ECML as a through route.
The NER & NBRs relations were quite strained and the NER were the company that ran the through passenger services except when relations reached breaking point and an engine change was required at Berwick.
Im not sure of the early lay out of the signal boxes but for convenience lets say Marshall Meadows was the next block point north from Berwick and the final block point on the English side of the border with i think Burnmouth being the first block point in Scotland.
There has been quite a bit of track remodelling at Marshall Meadows over the years the first was done after an NER 901 class 2-4-0 No.178 derailed on 10th August 1880 due to inadequate NBR track.
Confusion over Marshall Meadows being the border crossing is probably due to the relevant WTT for the area which is the section of track from Erlyhome Junction to Marshall Meadows.

Note that Berwick is in Northumberland and not Berwickshire which is a Scottish county with Duns as the seat of Administration.
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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by 52A » Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:31 pm

Many years ago (even before I was a lad!) there were 3 boxes at Berwick, South at the end of the Border Bridge, Central almost under the road bridge which became Berwick box before colour lights and north on the up side at the north end of the loops. North from here were Marshall Meadows with goods loops then Burnmouth in Scotland, the junction for the Eyemouth branch.

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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by 52D » Wed Feb 03, 2010 5:39 pm

Did the NER box at the end of the Royal Border Bridge get taken out of use in the 1924 remodelling of Berwick Station leaving the central box and the goods loop box which were replaced when the Tweedmouth power box came on line?
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Re: Tornado - Top Gear

Post by 52A » Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:35 pm

I do not know when they were taken out of service, Berwick North was certainly gone before the new Tweedmouth box took over in 1961 and the points at the north end were all power operated from Berwick (Central) before this date.

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