Proposed new footbridge at Copmanthorpe (York)

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Bullhead
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Re: Proposed new footbridge at Copmanthorpe (York)

Post by Bullhead »

PinzaC55 wrote:Those are not good examples.
Whether they're good examples or not, where you have potential conflict between road and rail traffic you have a significant risk to both - either through road user indiscipline or error, railway staff error, or equipment failure. Even modern MCB3 crossings bring their own problems.

The most effective way to control a risk is to eliminate it completely: which means closing existing level crossings where this is reasonably practicable, and being highly resistant to the introduction of new ones. This is why the ORR's current policy is not to allow new level crossings "other than in exceptional circumstances". My purely personal opinion is that this is a bit one size fits all, but I'm not the ORR. Nevertheless I am glad to see that (a) administrations such as the NRR have obviously succeeded in persuading the ORR that they are capable of measuring and managing the risk, and (b) a review of the legal framework surrounding LCs is being undertaken.
So - did anyone dare tell Stephenson, "It's not Rocket science"?
PinzaC55
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Re: Proposed new footbridge at Copmanthorpe (York)

Post by PinzaC55 »

Bullhead wrote:
PinzaC55 wrote:Those are not good examples.
Whether they're good examples or not, where you have potential conflict between road and rail traffic you have a significant risk to both - either through road user indiscipline or error, railway staff error, or equipment failure. Even modern MCB3 crossings bring their own problems.

The most effective way to control a risk is to eliminate it completely: which means closing existing level crossings where this is reasonably practicable, and being highly resistant to the introduction of new ones. This is why the ORR's current policy is not to allow new level crossings "other than in exceptional circumstances". My purely personal opinion is that this is a bit one size fits all, but I'm not the ORR. Nevertheless I am glad to see that (a) administrations such as the NRR have obviously succeeded in persuading the ORR that they are capable of measuring and managing the risk, and (b) a review of the legal framework surrounding LCs is being undertaken.
All we can really hope is that they count heritage railways as "exceptional cases". There's currently a major scheme to reopen the railway from Little Eaton to Ripley as a main line and I think someone said it will involve SEVEN level crossings. Could be an interseting test case?
PinzaC55
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Re: Proposed new footbridge at Copmanthorpe (York)

Post by PinzaC55 »

Richard said "They're even going as far as paying for a farmers' access roads to be moved to join with different roads and avoid grade crossings."

And that is absolute, basic common sense! I'm sure a lot of level crossings are there for historical reasons (land ownership) rather than practical. I'm sure (from memory) that the subject of this thread has a road bridge near it. I'll check up.
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richard
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Re: Proposed new footbridge at Copmanthorpe (York)

Post by richard »

They're finding many of the farmer crossings are unofficial - and have been for 50+ years. Traffic on them is usually very low but the users often treat them just as farm tracks , so accident rates are quite high relative to the road traffic on them.


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Bryan
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Re: Proposed new footbridge at Copmanthorpe (York)

Post by Bryan »

A similar situation arose on the Welsh Highland during the relay to Portmadoc.
Some crossings were moved, bridges provided, unofficial accesses closed up or improved and made official.
They even have gone as far as installing a flat crossing across the Network rail line.

If they can do this then standard level crossings on a heritage line should be possible.
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Re: Proposed new footbridge at Copmanthorpe (York)

Post by cambois »

ORR are quite approachable and any heritage line seeking to expand and create new level crossing should talk to ORR at an early stage. The big issues are likely to be measuring the risks in a quantifiable manner and the reasonableness test. And the reasonableness test is about money in the end. Not sure quite how it works in England now, but if a line is being extended using the Transport & Works Act to gain the powers then it may be possible to close some of the crossings.

Anyone who is interested in level crossing might find the recent Law Commission Consultation document interesting as it has masses of information on the legal issues surround them (but too late to respond now)
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