Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

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jwealleans
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by jwealleans »

Agreed. Sod of a place to drop your phone.
S.A.C. Martin
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by S.A.C. Martin »

Looks most excellent Graeme. Very nicely done.
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nzpaul
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by nzpaul »

If he's dropped one of these in there, there's definitely a problem. :roll:
old phone.png
Hatfield Shed
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Hatfield Shed »

Whatever the trouble may be, it must be significant for the driver to have stopped on the fast line. At least the signal box is in view, so protection shouldn't be a problem. (I would so like to know what exactly the driver is working on.)
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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Compared to the relatively brisk progress I made in adding the basic smokebox/boiler/cab of the loco and initially assembling its tender, I've been fathoming out and attempting to create or improve some trickier details for the Stirling 174 series in the last couple of weeks. It is rather like going back to the head-scratching and fiddling around that was involved in producing the chassis and running plate.
Anyway, the complete splashers and sandboxes have been put together from a multitude of painstakingly shaped and measured pieces. It took more than one attempt, and a bit of subterfuge, to arrive at middle splashers whose tops were wide enough to hide the OO wheels but which would also clear the sides of the firebox while still having an inner edge that appeared to be straight. Representation of the frame tops has also been added, between the splashers and alongside the smokebox base.
I'm only partly satisfied with the shape I've created for the low "piano front" filling the space between the frame tops ahead of the smokebox, which I've had to arrive at with the aid of a certain amount of guesswork and not a lot of guidance from my 174 series photos which only give side views. The NRM Doncaster drawing shows the intended shape, but that was with a sloping smokebox front which is not what is seen in the two photographs I have of the 174 series. Early photographs of early examples of Stirling's more numerous but smaller "Standard Goods" locos seem to show a low piano front, similar to the intended (drawn) one for the 174 class, but those "Standard" locos did not have such large, long cylinders under the smokebox. Later views of the "Standard" series show a taller piano front of more complex shape, especially when 4' 5" and larger diameter boilers were fitted. Enough of that puzzle anyway.
I've added the boiler handrail knobs too, in readiness for filling the front of the boiler permanently with lead. The straight wire currently slotted through the knobs is not the final handrail of course, it is simply helping to keep the knobs in place and in line.
I developed the urge to improve the tender too a couple of days ago, because the more I looked at it compared to the loco model and compared to one of my photographs, the more obvious it was that the type of tender represented by the Kitmaster is larger and has sturdier frames than the type paired with the 174 series locos. I have therefore tried to make the model look a bit more like the type of tender in the R12 drawings by Paul Craig in the late Malcolm Crawley's GNR tenders publication. There are two drawn versions of the R12 with different tank sizes, and on comparing these with dimensions estimated from a photograph I suspect another in-between tank size, so I wasn't sure which precise dimensions I should aim for, but I think I've created the generally correct look. That has involved lowering the top by cutting material out of the tank sides, rear and front just below the cornices. That has eliminated the original line of rivets, but those were incorrectly moulded below the visible joint rather than above it. I'll add new Archer rivets just before I eventually apply primer. I've also filed the cut-outs in the frames to resemble the more elongated, open shapes of the R12 type, added material to move the front edge of the frames (and the steps) forward to sit level with the beam across the front, thickened the representation of the ends of the rear buffer beam, and I've added the previously missing shallow lip where the platform under the tank projects over the edges of the frames.
DSCN0903 adj col.jpg
DSCN0899 adj col.jpg
Here's a reminder of the tender before I cut it down and added bits:
DSCN0879.JPG
It might be that I should have shortened the tank at the rear too, particularly if the altered model is considered to be the 2000 gallon version, but I won't get upset about that if nobody else does.
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Chas Levin
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Chas Levin »

Superb model, beautiful prototype, so nice to see it taking shape. :)
Chas
Dave S
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Dave S »

What chassis is the 174 on, is it one of your resin ones?
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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Hello Dave,

The chassis is scratchbuilt to correct wheelbase with properly profiled side frames and lightening/access holes (one set of holes revaling dummy con-rods) mostly in thick plasticard with brass bearings and the available spaces filled with lead. There's a modified Comet 38:1 gearbox and small Mitsumi motor. Given that the finished loco may still be a bit light even when the body is stuffed with lead too, I've made provision for an additional matched drive in the tender, from a similar motor with different gearing, to ensure that the combination will pull a good load if necessary.

While you are giving this your attention, I have a question: These and other early Stirling locos evidently had buffers with fat, somewhat bottle-shaped housings on square bases, not the same as the much later Spencer-Moultons that Gresley adopted or the LNER group standard ones. Do you know what the early GNR ones were known as, and are they offered in model form please? I can always make up some instead, in basic form if necessary.
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Dave S
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Dave S »

Atlantic 3279 wrote: Sun Oct 24, 2021 9:48 am I have a question:
If only I could answer it..... :?

I don't actually know, I have to admit that when I'm modelling the earlier I always go from a photograph and just replicate what's there without actually finding out what it might be called.

I'm not 100% sure what Mike Trice has drawn and has on Shapeways, but having said that the postal cost etc makes that avenue unviable now.
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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Amongst other pieces of tedious detail made and added to my 174 series:
STA71932.JPG
STA71929.JPG
STA71937.JPG
Including some idiosyncratic period GNR buffer stocks kindly 3D printed by "john coffin" of this parish.
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Chas Levin
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Chas Levin »

Beautiful work! :)
Chas
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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Thanks Chas. Clangers along the way have included failing to spot that the tender front plate was far too high until I wanted to fit the brake column, then having to get the saw and files out again to further alter that, as well as carefully inserting a disc of material making the chimney taller (as my first measurements suggested that it should be) and reducing the depth of the part of the cap below the widest part, before realizing that I had made it too tall (aggravating the problem of appearance since it is also a shade too slim) thus having to reduce the height again...
I've made an attempt to portray the pipes emerging from the cab front feeding steam (presumably from somewhere on the backhead) to a representation of injectors (made from wire and tube) on the sides of the ashpan and the water pipes bringing water from the tender to those injectors and onwards up the clack valves on the sides of the boiler. Parts of the reversing gear are also visible between middle and rear splashers on the right side of the loco as well as between the leading and driving wheels below the running plate. Mock lightening holes are present in the side frames, some of these revealing a suggestion of the side of a conrod. In the space under the forward part of the boiler barrel there's a representation of the tops of the slidebars and the motion plate.
The Kitmaster features on the smokebox door seemed a bit heavy so I've replaced the hinge straps and the handles with something finer. I believe the exotic array of front lamp irons is correct for the time around 1900 on the GNR. The "normal" 20th century type of drawhook may be correct for that time too, but I probably ought to add safety chains...
Also aiming at 1900 I've added brake gear to the loco. Neither of the available photographs show this at an earlier date, nor does the drawing, the 174 series as built relying on tender brakes using wooden blocks, but Groves records that at least three of the class got vac brakes around 1890.
STA71944small.jpg
STA71948.JPG
STA71949.JPG
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jwealleans
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by jwealleans »

at least three of the class got vac brakes around 1890.
Luxury!
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nzpaul
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by nzpaul »

jwealleans wrote: Thu Nov 11, 2021 10:13 pm
at least three of the class got vac brakes around 1890.
Luxury!
One one side only? Or are you not finished making brakes?

Paul
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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Atlantic's works: Another vintage goods engine.

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

B4'n'after pictures Paul.
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