Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

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Kestrel
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Kestrel »

Questions to the experts.

What was the correct line up of the Coronation train from the engine backwards? How many carriages were there? 9?

The new Hornby ones have:-
brake third & kitchen third articulated
double open first articulated
open third & kitchen third articulated
open third & brake third articulated
observation car 1719
Are these correct?

I found this link of a past auction
https://www.vectis.co.uk/lot/mail-coach ... hes_714230
and it contains 2 observation cars.

If there was one, what happened at the end of a journey? Was the observation car disconnected, turned around and put on the other end?

Was the train pulled by specific A4s? How many Coronation trains were there?
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teaky
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by teaky »

Nine coaches in total (in summer): four articulated pairs plus the observation coach.

See: https://uk.hornby.com/products/lner-cor ... a-3-r40226
and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Coron ... _train.jpg
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Kestrel
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Kestrel »

After writing the above, I found this:-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Coron ... _train.jpg
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Kestrel
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Kestrel »

Thanks for the above, Teaky.

Usually Hatton's announce their prices a day or two after Hornby announce new models. It's over a week since 2022's were announced and when asked when they were releasing their prices, Hatton's answer was 'I don't know. We'll let you know when we do'.

With them cancelling preorders for W1s and P2s last year, one wonders whether it's safer to order direct from Hornby despite having to pay more.
Seagull
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Seagull »

Kestrel wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 1:18 pm
I found this link of a past auction .... and it contains 2 observation cars.

If there was one, what happened at the end of a journey? Was the observation car disconnected, turned around and put on the other end?

Was the train pulled by specific A4s? How many Coronation trains were there?
There were two sets lettered as 'Coronation' each with an observation car. The observation car was only used for a few months during the summer.
It provided additional luggage space for the peak period as well as revenue from the observation lounge.

At the end of each journey the cars were detached from the tran and turned. At the south end the train set went to Hornsey carriage depot for cleaning and the observation car was almost certainly turned on the Hornsey loco shed turntable. At the Scottish end there was a choice of the Haymarket depot turntable or two triangles to the west of Waverley. I would guess they used one of the triangles.

There were two more sets built. One with no lettering as a spare and one lettered 'West Riding' and numbered in the GN area series 45xxx.
The numbers were as follows:-

______Coronation set 1 ____ set 2 ___ spare ___ W.Riding
Twin RTKB_____ 1711/12 _ 1721/22 _ 1731/32 _ 45801/02
Twin FO_______ 1713/14 _ 1723/24 _ 1733/34 _ 45811/12
Twin RTO______ 1715/16 _ 1725/26 _ 1735/36 _ 45821/22
Twin BTO______ 1717/18 _ 1727/28 _ 1737/38 _ 45831/32
Observation___ 1719 _____1720

Five locomotives were built for the Coronation service and during 1937 it was usually one of the five but substitutes were used. From mid 1938 onwards it could be almost any blue A4 with a corridor tender.

4488 Union of South Africa
4489 Dominion of Canada
4490 Empire of India
4491 Commonwealth of Australia
4492 Dominion of New Zealand

Alan
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JASd17
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by JASd17 »

Because the Coronation stopped en route a corridor tender was not necessary to work the service. Whilst non-corridor tender fitted locos were not regulars, several such as 4902 and 4467 worked whole weeks on occasion.

Crews changed at York in the Down direction and at Newcastle for the Up working.

John
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Worsdell#67261 »

Kestrel wrote: Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:53 pm Thanks for the above, Teaky.

Usually Hatton's announce their prices a day or two after Hornby announce new models. It's over a week since 2022's were announced and when asked when they were releasing their prices, Hatton's answer was 'I don't know. We'll let you know when we do'.

With them cancelling preorders for W1s and P2s last year, one wonders whether it's safer to order direct from Hornby despite having to pay more.
All because of them doing their Genesis coaches Hornby put Hattons into tier-3 with their new tier system for stockists & they decide when & if they'll get any of the new items when they come out.
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manna
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by manna »

All because of them doing their Genesis coaches Hornby put Hattons into tier-3 with their new tier system for stockists & they decide when & if they'll get any of the new items when they come out.
[/quote]

G'Day Gents

What a Ridiculous way to run a Company.

manna
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Seagull
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Seagull »

manna wrote: What a Ridiculous way to run a Company.
Simon Kholer went back into Hornby to bring it back into profit, he has done so.

1. Shut down the competition or reduce their effectiveness.
Hence Hattons being cut off at the knees over the Genesis coaches.
Also the sudden anouncements of new models to beat planned releases by the likes of Hattons, Rapido etc.

2. Protect your revenue stream.
The tier system and the retail agreements have been put in place to reduce the discounting. My regular suppler offered 15% discounts in the past, they only offer 10% now.

3. Pricing.
Hornby and Bachmann have put their pricing up to what the market will bare rather than cost + profit. It's more obvious with the older Bachmann locos, 10 years ago they were discounted to 40-50% of their present price. Hornby Railroad stuff is cheaper but even there they know that they can cream some profit off as much of it is sold as presents to doting parents/grandparents.

Plus we are all being squeezed by rising prices for transport. The cost of getting your shiny new locos or carriages from halfway around the world has gone up about 300-500% (maybe more) in the last year.

Alan
Last edited by Seagull on Thu Jan 27, 2022 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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mick b
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by mick b »

Hornby are really trying their luck to see what they can get away with. Kohler comes over as arrogant to me at least on the Hornby tv series , claiming superb models etc etc, when they are not .
They also are limiting build numbers , to inflate the selling prices as well and are treating Dealers very poorly .At the same time service and quality is on the way down .

Why they still keep churning out Triang type wagons and other rubbish is a weird business idea. Why they waste valuable production slots on sheer tat every year.

Recent Locos. Poor colour shades e.g BR and LNER Colours, poor/bodged designs e,g Footsteps hanging out and the Rear truck on the W1. General build quality. They cant even get delivery right, with numerous reports of wrecked Locos arriving at purchasers homes.

Number One problem they have at the moment is , a potentially very big financial problem.
They appear to have shot therselves in the foot with breaching copyright on the Titfield Thunderbolt copies thay are desparately trying to get out before Rapido . They have taken on Studio Canal at the same time the owner of the copyright , a billion pound company who will not be impressed with their antics and no doubt sueing if the items with a lame cover description on the boxes are actually sold..
Wolf of Badenoch
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Wolf of Badenoch »

Seagull wrote: Thu Jan 27, 2022 1:28 pm
manna wrote: What a Ridiculous way to run a Company.
Simon Kholer went back into Hornby to bring it back into profit, he has done so.

1. Shut down the competition or reduce their effectiveness.
Hence Hattons being cut off at the knees over the Genesis coaches. Remember Bachmann have done the same to Rails, as have Hornby.
Also the sudden anouncements of new models to beat planned releases by the likes of Hattons, Rapido etc.

2. Protect your revenue stream.
The tier system and the retail agreements have been put in place to reduce the discounting. My regular suppler offered 15% discounts in the past, they only offer 10% now.

3. Pricing.
Hornby and Bachmann have put their pricing up to what the market will bare rather than cost + profit. It's more obvious with the older Bachmann locos, 10 years ago they were discounted to 40-50% of their present price. Hornby Railroad stuff is cheaper but even there they know that they can cream some profit off as much of it is sold as presents to doting parents/grandparents.

Plus we are all being squeezed by rising prices for transport. The cost of getting your shiny new locos or carriages from halfway around the world has gone up about 300-500% (maybe more) in the last year.

Alan
Bachmann have done what to Rails, they are still supplying them as normal, perhaps you should check before posting on here
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manna
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by manna »

G'Day Gents

I look at myself and think, I'm luckier than most, I don't really need to pay the exorbitant prices the two main RTR companies want to charge me, I still have enough parts, to build another half dozen loco's, some of which Hornby and Bachmann will never build.

Remember, 'People who live on Cream, die of Heart attacks'.

manna
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Seagull
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Seagull »

Wolf of Badenoch wrote: Thu Jan 27, 2022 7:54 pm perhaps you should check before posting on here
You are right and I have corrected the offending post.

Perhaps you should consider the way you word your posts.

Alan
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Only a personal thought, but might it be better for the health of the forum (including relationships between contributors) if the discussion is now steered in the direction of the technical merits (and value?) or otherwise of the models, rather than getting further into the politics and rumours surrounding the willingness or refusal of particular "manufacturers" to supply particular retailers? There seems to be plenty of rumour and bickering on "that other channel", frequently getting out of control and leading to locked topics.
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1

Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
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Kestrel
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Re: Hornby 2022 LNER Coronations are coming !!

Post by Kestrel »

I've just been on the Hornby website.

When the Coronations were announced, they were charging £108.99 for each of the 4 pairs of artics and £66.99 for the observation car. That's £502.95.

Now the artics are £139.99 a pair and the observation car is £74.99, making a total of £634.95. This is an increase of £132.00.

Meanwhile, the associated A4s have remained at £217.99.
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