LNER B17 & B1 Locomotives

[Mersey508138]

Hi Everyone

I recently purchased a hornby B17 loco chassis off ebay ( remarkably free running ) which I had originally thought of converting so that it would be a loco drive chassis.

I puchased it with the possibility of fitting it under a Bachmann B1 loco body which I have successfully managed to do although I think the body may be a little high as it looks almost like a 9F with daylight under the boiler. After looking at the chassis block I had to make the decision not to attempt to convert the chassis so that it would be loco driven due to the work involved and potential to damage any bearings on the axles ( if fitted ).

I did try to convert a tender drive 9F locomotive chassis once but it was a drastic failure and it had limited traction ability ( 3 coaches or 8 wagons if I was lucky ) so my thinking is to try and find a hornby tender drive similar to the B1 to make my loco operational.

Can I ask please if the 2 loco classes had the same chassis in reality or were they different in terms of wheel size, wheel spacing etc ?.

Here is the loco in question sitting on my bookshelf, the brakevan behind it is part of the stock for an O gauge project still in the very early stages.

Any comments and / or suggestions for the loco welcome and appreciated

[mick b]

Click on Home Page then on Locomotives all the sizes are there etc.

[UpDistant]

Except the wheel spacing isn't mentioned.

Bogie wheel base and coupled wheel base are the same between B1 and B17, the only difference is an extra 3" between the rear bogie wheel and the leading coupled wheel.

[Mersey508138]

Thank you for the replies received up to now, I will have to see if I can find a longer bar that connects the bogie to the chassis and which also alliws it to pivot.

The front bogie fixed to the chassis was the only bogie I could find. I might have another bogie somewhere which might be more suitable, its just a matter of digging through a huge load of spare bits from other locos in my fleet which are in various stages of possible rebuild in order to find it, chances of success are about 1.5 % at the moment as I have no idea where to start.

Please keep the comments and suggestions coming.

[manna]

G'Day Gents

When the Hornby B17 was first introduced (App 1980) I saw a B17 converted to a B1, which then wasn't available RTR, by replacing the large drivers with those from a Britannia, he then replaced the running plate at a lower level. looked pretty good t.

manna

[Ocean Swell]

The B17s had 6ft 8 driving wheels and the B1s 6ft 2. A B1 body on a B17 chassis sounds like a good starting point for a Thompson B2.

[Atlantic 3279]

For the B2, more effective to re-wheel the B1 chassis to 26 or 26.6mm (which automatically jacks the B1 boiler centre line up to more or less the correct B17/B2 height), add the cut-outs and splashers to the B1 running plate, use an adapted B17 cab, increase the drop at the front of the running plate to bring the buffer beam back down to proper height, and swap to a B17 type chimney. You can then count the number of spokes in the bogie wheels to if you can be bothered, and make sure you have either the right sort of LNER 4200 gallon tender (low front), the right sort of former NER tender, or the correctly shortened version of a former P1 tender.

Here's one I did in or before 2009. Conversion was featured on one of the previous incarnations of RMweb which has now almost certainly either been allowed to fall-over without any proper back-up files, or has been arbitrarily destroyed as part of so-called upgrades and improvements...

https://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic. ... 069#p17069

https://www.lner.info/forums/download/f ... &mode=view

[Horsetan]

....When the Hornby B17 was first introduced (App 1980) I saw a B17 converted to a B1, which then wasn't available RTR, by replacing the large drivers with those from a Britannia, he then replaced the running plate at a lower level. looked pretty good ...

Crownline produced a conversion kit that would allow you to convert a Hornby B17 to either a B1 or a B2. Quite ingenious etches for their day. Strangely enough, the etched front frame sections for the B2 were actually the correct shape for the B1, whilst the ones provided for the B1 were a bit wrong!

[Mersey508138]

Sincere thanks for all replies, please do keep them coming

[Hatfield Shed]

...I recently purchased a hornby B17 loco chassis off ebay ( remarkably free running ) which I had originally thought of converting so that it would be a loco drive chassis...

This was one of several Margate productions I converted to loco drive from now near forty years past, simply because tender drive reliant on rubber tyres is useless for outdoor operation. The technique was pretty crude: araldite strips of nickel-silver reinforcement to the chassis block sides, slot down through the mazak block to the axle to be driven, put in a salvaged RTR mechanism from the Mainline/Dapol N2 (later a Mashima motor on a gear train from 'Branchlines') and off it went.

All the locos so treated were packed with lead for traction, and I 'discovered' that having got my 9F up to 800g the wear out rate was significant, and there came a day when a wheel on the drive axle slipped and ripped the connecting rod apart that side, and severely bent it the other side...

But hey, it was real fun operating in the prototype environment.

[Mersey508138]

I definitely like the idea of doing that

[Mersey508138]

Hi Everyone

The latest update on the loco is that the engine body is a bit lower than shown in the picture I posted, there is still some remedial work to do in order to make the steps on the loco and tender level with each other..

I had to do some filing work to lower the body as the driving wheels would have hammed inside the firebox area and under the wheel splashers, fortunately this was successful and the wheels continue to turn freely.

Once they are sorted out, the next task will be to find a suitable motor for the loco, I have not decided which to do yet and I welcome all opinions offered.

If I decide to motorise the loco can I ask please what is the best way to do that and which tools will do the job without destroying the chassis as I am not too sure about doing it myself although I could, it's just a case of whether I would have the right tools for the job.

[Atlantic 3279]

I won't recommend specific tools, especially for job I haven't actually tried, not least because I have a long record of improvisation and use of non-ideal tools for various jobs. True engineers, purists, theorists, and the "stealth 'n' safety" commissars would no doubt be horrified, but I venture to suggest that it is as much to do with using tools in a careful, patient and well thought-out manner, as it is to do with using the "right" tools.

[Hatfield Shed]

...it is as much to do with using tools in a careful, patient and well thought-out manner, as it is to do with using the "right" tools.

Strongly seconded: the evidence is there from prehistoric metalcraft by people unknown; a trip to the British museum will quickly confirm.

For 'butchery' to mazak RTR steam loco chassis for the purpose of inserting a motor and drive line: a steel rule, engineers square, vice, scriber, vernier caliper, junior hacksaw, files and drills were what I started with.

[Mersey508138]

The latest on my loco is that it is coupled to a tender containing a silver seal motor which I converted to a cd motor drive which I created self made supports for it and managed to make is mesh perfectly with the gear cogs on the motor.

I also added my own self made pickups for both sides of the loco's driving wheels and it works well. It was been tested this morning to see if it would haul 10 Bachmann mk1 coaches which it did with a little bit of wheel slip, however, once it got going it was no problem for the loco to haul the load but I think more weight is needed, the question is where to fit it.