Location Setting for Model Railway

[JEBP]

Good afternoon gentlemen,

I have been a long time lurker, however the planning of a model railway product now draws me from the shadows.

Firstly though I must complement the forum on its collective knowledge and readiness to share and develop this, as a result of which I have spent many hours enjoying improving my own understanding of the railway. I have particularly enjoyed the memories of the older members of the forum, both from professional and amateur involvement with the railways and also the depth of academic knowledge of forum members on the system and the stock that ran on it. So thank you.

I am relatively ignorant on the finer points of railway operations, but regression to youth has re-activated an interest in modelling, hence the railway. It has been over 25 years since I last ran a model train. At that time I used to live within the hinterland that is served by the GN spur from Hitchin to Cambridge, which inspired a broad LNER theme to my then model. I now live overseas (in NZ).

My modelling resurgence has seen the cart fly by well ahead of any horses and I have amassed a collection of locos and stock over the last few years without a layout to run it on. The collection of stock has been without any particular regard to where exactly (or indeed when) I might model, except to say that it is all BR 1950-60 ish from the ER (A1, A3, A4, A5 B1, B17, L1, Js and Ds) with some exceptions of BR standard classes (4, 5, 7 and 9). I know, some members will be shifting uncomfortably in seats at this mix, brows furrowed, however I hope they will be mindful of the mitigating factor of midlife crisis in passing sentence.

I will undoubtedly be applying Rule 1 in fair measure, however would still like to have an underlying reality for operations, which leads to my conundrum of model setting and appeal for members’ assistance.

I don’t have unlimited space (broadly a 20 ft by 2.5 ft straight scenic section plus additional for off scene curves and storage loops), however enough to loosely model a small mainline station with decent platform lengths, possibly a junction situation with a small loco depot.

Initially, I had intended a fictional location south of Cambridge but north of the GN connection (being well known to me) so I could run ex LNER locos as well as Britannias, which for some reason I have always loved. However an inability to resist acquiring some lovely models of A1s, A3s, A4s and V2s means that this location becomes tenuous (albeit I know they did operate up there on occasions).

V2s and A3s mean that I could adopt an ex GC theme pre 1957, although with the Brits and A4s among others, I am not sure this would hold either.
I don’t want to run express after express (or rather I can’t afford to), so would prefer to avoid the trunk ECML, but I would still like to feature some pacific hauled expresses. I suspect this rules out most of the southern ECML and also areas such as Lincolnshire, where these larger trains were only routed during engineering works to the main line(??).

Potentially, this leaves the Middlesborough or Scarborough lines and Leeds area without crossing the border with Scotland, possibly others, I don’t know.

I have been inspired by the incredible Leeds Central Model built by one of our members and the Leeds area in general interests me because of the myriad companies that developed lines there. I did wonder about some of the satellite locations.

As a rough setting, Ardsley appeals on account of the loco shed and junction to Bradford, although again, significant downscaling would be required – I am not sure whether this would be a go. I would not intend (initially at least) to replicate exact buildings/track plan, more the general mechanics of the location.

I have spent some time researching options but feel that I have now exhausted my knowledge and the obvious online resources. As such, if any of our members would be prepared to share their knowledge/advice/ideas/ thoughts of potential locations, I would be most appreciative.

Thank you.

Regards, John.

[Clock O' the North]

G'Day
I'll have to admit it, that is a rather nice chunk of space you have there. I personally would suggest modelling a fictional but possible terminus in London. It might no be that accurate but it then allows you to pick what you want to run. Just one question though that you should probably ask yourself, Is there going to be other people to run on the layout as well as myself? If the answer is yes than I would think about DCC and try coming up with a terminus track plan. If the answer is no then a double track station with a branch line would probably suit.
CotN

[Hatfield Shed]

There is a route just a little South of Hitchin which is of the ECML, but not on it: the Ponsbourne loop. You might even decide that the LNER in an early fit of rationalisation created a single 'Hertford Town' station serving all of the Loop, the former GE line, and the Hatfield branch. There's the possibility of a two track mainline with branch junction and terminating facilities, and a new loco shed to serve the terminating GE services. You have a free hand on building design for this ficititious station, though what the LNER built in the 1920s at WGC might be a guide.

Diverted ECML trains can run through with pacific power as the whim takes you, with the regular passenger trains being run by B1s (supplemented by any of the three BR std 5MT 34A had for a while and Cambridge B17s) and the several tank classes that were typical in the area, N2, N7, L1, A5; the freight of course mainly behind 9F and WD, but 'seasoned' with every imaginable former LNER southern area steam freight type and the other BR period introductions. Unlike most secondary locations where a very limited number of classes - and individual locos from those classes only - would be seen much the majority of the time, there's no shortage of potential variety in traction and types of service.

[JEBP]

G'Day
I'll have to admit it, that is a rather nice chunk of space you have there. I personally would suggest modelling a fictional but possible terminus in London. It might no be that accurate but it then allows you to pick what you want to run. Just one question though that you should probably ask yourself, Is there going to be other people to run on the layout as well as myself? If the answer is yes than I would think about DCC and try coming up with a terminus track plan. If the answer is no then a double track station with a branch line would probably suit.
CotN

Thanks Clock. The thought of modelling a terminus had occurred, especially having seen the Leeds Central model. At one stage I toyed with doing something like Marylebone, which I believe accommodated much of the WCML traffic during the Euston upgrade (although that may have been later).

When I was young I had a model of a terminus station and used to read Railway Modeler with green eyes at any railway of the month with a double track mainline. Now having the space and opportunity do own one myself, my inclination is to stick with this. However tinkering around with terminating services, loco changeovers, coach shunting (even if to hypothetical carriage sidings off scene) definitely appeals. Hence, a location with these features would be ideal.

Thanks also for the thoughtful DCC advice - Most likely it will just be me tinkering around of an evening although the locos I have amassed to date are mostly DCC ready or fitted, so DCC it is.

Cheers,
John

There is a route just a little South of Hitchin which is of the ECML, but not on it: the Ponsbourne loop. You might even decide that the LNER in an early fit of rationalisation created a single 'Hertford Town' station serving all of the Loop, the former GE line, and the Hatfield branch. There's the possibility of a two track mainline with branch junction and terminating facilities, and a new loco shed to serve the terminating GE services. You have a free hand on building design for this ficititious station, though what the LNER built in the 1920s at WGC might be a guide.

Diverted ECML trains can run through with pacific power as the whim takes you, with the regular passenger trains being run by B1s (supplemented by any of the three BR std 5MT 34A had for a while and Cambridge B17s) and the several tank classes that were typical in the area, N2, N7, L1, A5; the freight of course mainly behind 9F and WD, but 'seasoned' with every imaginable former LNER southern area steam freight type and the other BR period introductions. Unlike most secondary locations where a very limited number of classes - and individual locos from those classes only - would be seen much the majority of the time, there's no shortage of potential variety in traction and types of service.

Thanks Hatfield. I hadn't thought of that. That is an excellent suggestion which ticks most of those boxes. I will do some digging on this. As a small aside, am I right in thinking that Kings X also had a small allocation of Brits at one stage?

Cheers,
John

[LNER4479]

Hi there.

The only comment I would make with regard to your opening post is not to assume that the southern end of the ECML was 'express after express' (as you state) - because it wasn't!

Admittedly, our project 'Grantham' is set in LNER days but a similar principle applied in that many of the expresses were 'flighted', ie bunched together, following which there would be a long period without any express passenger activity to allow the far more numerous (and arguable far more important!) goods trains to make their way up and down the line.

The ECML was - and to some extent still is - blighted by prolonged stretches of two-track railway and the above method of operation is classic steam era railway operating (and quite different from today). Post-war, the situation was eased by the Hadley Wood widening scheme which finally got rid of a notorious two-track section (the LNER had wanted to do this but couldn't afford it in the depressed 1930's). Furthermore, from 1957 onwards there was a general acceleration of services with some faster, lighter-weight trains which started along the road towards a more even service pattern that we're more used to nowadays.

So - particularly if you're more 1950's than 1960's, a double track stretch of the ECML is definitely worth considering.

[Hatfield Shed]

...As a small aside, am I right in thinking that Kings X also had a small allocation of Brits at one stage?...

No allocation of Brits to KX. But they did appear on the Southern half of the ECML in the last five years of steam. Doncaster picked up overhauls on the Brits in the late 1950s, and every now and again one would escape on an up working. Then from some time in 1960 to late 1962 Immingham built up an allocation - ultimately of a half a dozen - ex GE section Brits, and among other duties they regularly operated two services terminating at KX. So you can have them with both the common tenders.

[31A]

If you're thinking of a terminus, I've sometimes thought of making a fictitious model along the lines of one of the 19th century proposals for separate stations in Cambridge for the different railway companies, e.g. perhaps a separate Great Northern terminus. That way the trains which used the Hitchin-Cambridge line could be depicted including on the odd occasion Pacifics on running in turns, etc. Or you could stretch it further and imagine a joint GN / LNW station, for example.

[Dufus]

Hi JEBP,

Looks like we are running on parallel lines.I have been lurking as a guest on a couple of forums thinking about a layout but never had the room. We are moving into a new place on Tuesday and I will finally have the room for a layout. I have been a bit of a model maker all my life but never in a railway context. It has always been aircraft or ships and the occasional car. A couple of months ago I was challenged to enter something into a car club competition. I ended up doing a mini diorama based around a bashed up dinky toy that was made to look similar to my classic car. I bashed a Metcalfe building adding a trolley jack and the legs of a mechanic made of modeling clay. I won first prize but got bitten by the bug.

I have decided to go for a segment of the ECML around Huntingdon. It will not be a copy of a particular section, rather I aim to cherry pick features from the area. For instance I am going to include the 'Iron Bridge' at the bottom of St. Peters Road. I also aim to include the level crossing at Offord Cluny and the church at Wood Walton. They are all places that have some significance for me so now in the time to indulge.

I had been tempted to go for the GWR in North Devon as that is where I grew up just before all the closures in the 1960's but the locos I have would not fit that and the area around Huntingdon had such a huge diversity, with Midland stock coming through Kimbolton towards St. Ives where the Great Eastern trains ran on to Ely and Cambridge.

Unfortunately I have to do some decorating and sorting out my new office before I can really get going, but I hope to make some progress before the summer.
regards, Dufus

[Jazz Fan]

There is a route just a little South of Hitchin which is of the ECML, but not on it: the Ponsbourne loop. You might even decide that the LNER in an early fit of rationalisation created a single 'Hertford Town' station serving all of the Loop, the former GE line, and the Hatfield branch. There's the possibility of a two track mainline with branch junction and terminating facilities, and a new loco shed to serve the terminating GE services. You have a free hand on building design for this ficititious station, though what the LNER built in the 1920s at WGC might be a guide.

Diverted ECML trains can run through with pacific power as the whim takes you, with the regular passenger trains being run by B1s (supplemented by any of the three BR std 5MT 34A had for a while and Cambridge B17s) and the several tank classes that were typical in the area, N2, N7, L1, A5; the freight of course mainly behind 9F and WD, but 'seasoned' with every imaginable former LNER southern area steam freight type and the other BR period introductions. Unlike most secondary locations where a very limited number of classes - and individual locos from those classes only - would be seen much the majority of the time, there's no shortage of potential variety in traction and types of service.

I assume this is what I knew as the Hertford Loop in my youth in Enfield. This line was in sight of the playing fields at the Grammar School, and I recall days when lots of ECML traffic was diverted along it. This played havoc with our PE lessons on the fields as the railfans amongst us would keep stopping our activity to watch the trains pass in the distance. A goal was scored in a soccer game while the entire defence was distracted by a 9F hauling coal empties northwards!

[Jazz Fan]

I was alerted to this website by finding several posts responding to a query about prototype justification for running Southern Railway and LNER stock together from a few years back. This is a problem I have been considering in the last few weeks. Returning to modelling after a break of nearly thirty years I am finding resisting the purchase of some of the exquisite r-t-r models now current quite difficult. My interests are 1950's Eastern Region (nostalgia for childhood) and Southern Region up to the end of steam, this latter having fascinated me for years.
After looking through atlases and OS maps I decided that my imagination must re-write railway history. In short, I postulated a tunnel under the Thames from North Woolwich, emerging adjacent to the Royal Arsenal, and the line then following the bank of the river around Plumstead Marshes and terminating to the north of Belvedere. This area, in reality, was subject to much industrial development and rail access would have been a boon. This imaginary line then had a link to the SECR line towards Erith. Now I have convinced myself that this a reasonable way to run ex-GER locos, especially the forthcoming Oxford Rail N7 tank, on trains from Stratford, while Southern locos, including the forthcoming Hornby H Class tank plus push-pull set could operate to, say, Dartford and beyond.
I guess this is an example of a train of thought becoming a flight of fancy, but that's part of how I enjoy the hobby. Another part of the enjoyment is reading the posts on this site, so glad I found it.