Cancelled order - V2

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Kestrel
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Cancelled order - V2

Post by Kestrel » Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:28 pm

I had an email today from Hatton's saying that:

You currently have an outstanding pre-order for the following:

Class V2 2-6-2 4791 in LNER green

We are no longer able to fulfil this pre-order and have therefore cancelled the order on our system and from your account.


Does anyone know what this about? Why has it been cancelled? I couldn't get through to Hatton's.

williewhizz
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by williewhizz » Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:23 pm

This is a consequence of a long-running dispute between Hattons and Bachmann, the precise details of which neither side has been willing to discuss publicly, despite a great deal of internet-based speculation by the 'modelling public'; but the practical consequence seems to be that the manufacturer has been declining to supply the retailer with product for the best part of a year. Very little of this has been reported in the 'print' modelling media.

According to a thread on another forum, it appears everyone who has pre-ordered Bachmann forthcoming products has now (or should have) received an e-mail of this nature, though again few actual details are given. It might be plausible to speculate that Hattons are taking this step because they have given up hope the dispute might be amicably resolved any time soon, and they don't wish to disappoint their customers.

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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by kimballthurlow » Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:17 pm

I had exactly this email regarding the release of an 0-6-0 NER lined green E1 tank engine #2173.
(.... The later LNER J72)
That's a shame.
It is possible that Hattons were unable to achieve the quantity of pre-orders for the project to be viable.

Kimball

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greenglade
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by greenglade » Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:49 pm

Manufacturers don't stop supplying a retailer unless they have a problem with production or the retailer concerned has an outstanding payment and have frozen the account until that's sorted. Could this be the issue?, interesting that you couldn't get through to Hattons directly either and to be honest, the wording of the notification leaves a lot to be desired, no apology or any details whatsoever? Not good practice for sure...

Just an observation, I have no knowledge of Hattons but I do know how manufacturers operate.

Pete

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richard
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by richard » Thu Aug 08, 2019 2:46 am

The "no details" is pretty much the same when Amazon notify about the cancellation of a pre-ordered book...

Individual books get cancelled all the time though.
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mick b
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by mick b » Thu Aug 08, 2019 7:27 am

The Dark Side, are speculating that Bachmann have got the hump over Hattons making their own stuff to sell.

The prices Bachmann are trying to sell stuff beats me , how they sell anything anyway :lol: :lol:

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Kestrel
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by Kestrel » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:01 am

Just managed to speak to Hattons.

The 'dispute' with Bachmann is continuing and so Hattons "have cancelled any preorders they have and aren't taking orders for Bachmann products for the foreseeable future".

The stock they do have will be for sale.

exile
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by exile » Thu Aug 08, 2019 12:06 pm

As stated it seems most likely that the "problem" is connected with Hattons becoming a manufacturer - and unlike others (Rails, Kernow) - they are prepared to offer their models to the rest of the trade. As such they become a direct competitor to Bachmann.

Comments about the possibility that Hattons have a poor payment record should be very measured since if false that could lead to defamation claims and prosecution through the civil courts.

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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Thu Aug 08, 2019 12:26 pm

On a purely technical point, I'm not sure that action in British civil courts can be described as prosecution. Isn't that reserved for criminal matters?
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1

Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.

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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by Hatfield Shed » Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:47 pm

exile wrote:
Thu Aug 08, 2019 12:06 pm
As stated it seems most likely that the "problem" is connected with Hattons becoming a manufacturer - and unlike others (Rails, Kernow) - they are prepared to offer their models to the rest of the trade. As such they become a direct competitor to Bachmann...
I think Hattons took it further than that, not just distributing their own manufactures, but I also recall them proposing a plan for reciprocally stocking other retailer's currently exclusive products?

A quick look at Bachmann's T&C's for approved retailers finds a sentence in I think item 11, giving Bachmann discretion to part company from any retailer manufacturing and/or distributing product.

What Hattons are doing is perfectly legal. In their shoes, I would be tooling a superb V2 which Bachmann have signally failed to deliver...

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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by Mersey508138 » Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:54 pm

I managed to create a V2 although some of the parts may not be correct and to everyones liking but to me, it looks like a V2, pulls like 1 and does the job thats asked of it.

Here is what I used to create the loco ( please note that I understand some of the parts may be wrong but it works ).

Hornby fowler 2-6-4 chassis ( latest type where the rear bogie and its support can be removed )
40 thou plasticard to support the rear of the loco body and cab
Kit built V2 loco body.

The body does require a significant amount of modifications mostly inside to allow it to fit around the hornby motor including some masking tape around any bare wires or the inside of the boiler to prevent shorting the power and will also need drilling at the front and through the cab floor to provide fixing points for nuts and bolts or self tapping screws.

The only other thing with this is that a rear pony wheelset will need to be made for the rear of the chassis at the cab end but with a bit of improvisation it can be done.

Also though many will say tender pickups are not necessary, I added them into the Bachmann tender that came from my split chassis V2 I bought nearly 20 years ago and wired them through to the loco which is also fitted with pickups I made which touch on the actual wheel treads instead of the back of the wheels and ensure much better power collection for the motor.

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richard
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by richard » Thu Aug 08, 2019 7:35 pm

Can we cut out the speculation? Everyone is guessing - and some of those guesses could be libel. We will find out the answers eventually.

To clarify my comment about books, the imho the "no details" is a lot more common that implied, and is probably the norm rather than the exception.
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Horsetan
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by Horsetan » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:11 pm

Atlantic 3279 wrote:
Thu Aug 08, 2019 12:26 pm
On a purely technical point, I'm not sure that action in British civil courts can be described as prosecution. Isn't that reserved for criminal matters?
Correct.

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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Fri Aug 09, 2019 8:31 am

Much obliged to m'learned friend.
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1

Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.

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Kestrel
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Re: Cancelled order - V2

Post by Kestrel » Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:29 am

If you were being done for libel, the case would be heard in a civil/family court and the judge would make his decision. I know, I've been there.

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