Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions (Complete...not quite)

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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Having not made use of the idea, as clearly stated in my original post on the matter, I obviously have no photographs to illustrate the method nor any detailed explanations to offer. Anybody wanting to implement the idea will have to work from photographs and drawings in order to produce the most realistic / typical result, and I have listed several suitable sources, such as the Harris book on the older GN/ECJS vehicles, Campling's book of drawings, and once you identify the kind or kinds of vehicles that are of interest, the Isinglass drawings range.
My general methods for this sort of thing can be gleaned by looking at at the carriage conversion projects that I have also already listed on the previous page of this topic. I don't think they need to be re-explained here.
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Jim de Griz
NER J27 0-6-0
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

I finally got round to starting this project

As previous stated I’d already stained the sides and painted the roof/interior so I focused on the underframes and bogies

Here’s where I started from
D1E51588-08BB-4473-8E58-61D96468A11D.jpeg
&
8FFD4D94-7705-4BA3-B386-77DD6CF65714.jpeg
I’m replacing the non-gresley bogies with Isinglass 3D printed ones, but leaving the ones on the Buffet Car alone as they are close enough for my purposes. I like the Isinglass bogies but I find I need to file about a 1mm off the adaptor to get the ride height to match the coaches on hornby bogies. Its a fiddly job but manageable (it helps that it doesn’t matter if the adaptor is filed 100% flat and square, you can allow for inaccuracies when you bolt the bogie to the frame)
7F3BE4D2-3A8D-4EA9-BBA0-3D6FCD4552AE.jpeg
Just a touch to high.

After that I used a razor saw, scalpel and file to remove the existing underframe detail
93520CD9-9863-40C7-8F55-C078EB124B0F.jpeg
I also had to cut down the Isinglass battery boxes (razor saw again) in order to account flush deck of the hornby frame and cut the prongs off the hornby glazing because the battery boxes cover the holes they should fit in.
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

I decided to scatch build the turnbuckle under-frame from wire and plastic. Tried a few different methods before simplying the job as seen below. Not 100% happy with their look, but an improvement I feel. I also scratch built the battery boxes for the buffet car as the pictures I have show a different kind of box.
21374F7E-75B1-4575-B1B4-093D37739DE9.jpeg
Note to self, check which end your cutting before you start :roll:

Unfortunately I could only fit one vacuum brake cylinder as there isn’t space for the 2nd. Maybe with a bit more surgery I could have managed it, but thats now a lesson identified for the future.

After that it was just a matter of painting, bolting the bogies on and refitting the body. Overall, while I appreciate they are representative of a GNR design rather than sticking to any particular diagram, I’m quite pleased with the results.
B1533BF1-CCAA-469B-828C-815FBE6592A6.jpeg
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nzpaul
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by nzpaul »

Nothing wrong with tarting up the old shorty Gresley coaches, especially when chopped up a bit and made to represent a specific coach and given a half decent teak paint job. It's good fun and cheap, and usually leads to more advanced efforts.
I think you've managed to flip the image of the last photo, or you were holding the camera backwards... :roll:


Paul
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

My iPhone and the forum had a little bit of an argument and decided to displayed the original image upside down. Flipping the image made it display right side up, but obviously reversed the lettering. :roll:

Jim de Griz
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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Interesting to see the work in progress Jim. Does the ride height problem with the new bogies actually stem from 2 sources, both the mounting pivot height (evident from the gap between bogie and solebar) and the use of scale diameter wheels instead of Hornby's old type?
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Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

I reused the Hornby wheels so I think its the pivot height. (I assume the wheels are original, but they are metal rather than plastic)

I’ve had the same problem with all three of the Isinglass kits I’ve build and all needed the same modification.

That said, I’d be interested to know which model is actual correct. But, for my own purposes I felt it more important that all my coaches share a common ride height than they ride at exactly the right height. It was a lot easier to lower 3 kit build coaches as I built them than try and figure out how to raise 12 Hornby and 2 Triang chassis.

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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Surprisingly perhaps, I think the overall ride heights, depth of sides, level of cornice etc are as nearly correct on the Margate Gresleyoids as one could wish. If the other features of the models / toys had been right, they'd have been wonderful.
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Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

I did say I wanted to have a go at the clerestory conversion and I know your not supposed to make a model of a model, but I wanted to have a go anyway. :D

There is still some filling left to do, but I've mostly managed to get the roof and the windows sorted out. Waiting for some top hat bearings and some bolts so I can get the fox bogies fitted.
IMG_2648.jpg
IMG_2649.jpg
Thank you for posting the original Atlantic, I certainly picked up a few tricks reading your posts.

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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

I'm glad you enjoyed producing something different from the RTR offering.
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Graeme Leary
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Graeme Leary »

And this thread has brought to mind the current RMWeb so called '2022 Wish List'' where there is a box to tick (section 13) titled "NER Non-gangwayed stock - clerestory, matchboard, Elliptical 49'/52' (various diagrams)'" which I trust every forum member has ticked.

Not exactly the subject of the topic but if it helps get some accurate r-t-r clerestory coaches (in particular) made, it's well worth doing it.

And also the "LNER/Gresley Triplet Articulated Restaurant Set (dias 12,13 & 14 - 1924)" . I have these from a Wizard (I think) kit but would happily buy a properly replicated r-t-r model set.

And for good measure - also tick (section 04) Worsdell J21 and Gresley D49 - a 'proper' model, not like the earlier Hornby effort.

Graeme Leary
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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

Lets have those ticks in the box for GCR matchboard stock (not Barnums) too - preferably for vastly less than £70 per coach, correctly modelled and fully decorated inside and out, in the right shades of the right colours, especially the teak which must of course be a reasonable match to my own home-brewed teak shades...
No need for any bizarre cam-mounted couplings for so-called close-coupling on tiny train sets with toy-town curves, and no cost-adding bright twinkly internal lights and DCC control guff please.
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Graeme Leary
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Graeme Leary »

Hear hear Atlantic 3279 for your 2nd paragraph.

Sadly though the company(ies) that make just what you've described probably don't read or listen to these kind of sentiments so will continue with their infantile offerings.

Merry Christmas from the Southern Hemisphere.

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Woodcock29
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Woodcock29 »

Agree totally with previous 2 posts.
Andrew
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

Complete!
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An enjoyable project, it was surprisingly straight forward to build the supporting structure for the roof, though as expected shaping and fitting the roof was far more difficult.

I think the teak is maybe a touch too light for such an old vehicle, considering adding a wash over the top to darken it.

Fox Bogies are from Isinglass, as are the battery boxes and the vacuum cylinder. Pretty much all other additions are scratch built from plastikard and/or brass wire.

Jim de Griz
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