Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions (Complete...not quite)

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Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

A bow pen sounds like my next purchase then! Are they generally suitable for enamel paints? (Edit: Just noticed that question had already been answered, thinned enamel paint, tick)
Danby Wiske wrote: Sun Feb 12, 2023 8:37 pm The removal of the door ventilators was definitely worth the effort. It completely changes the appearance of the coach...
I very much agree, I was VERY surprised by how visible a difference it made. To be honest, even if I wasn't going to go to the bother of trying to cut and shunt the sides, I'd still want to cut out the ventilators on future coaches.

Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

If the pen nib is honed well enough, you won't need to thin the enamel. I use un-thinned Humbrol. The thicker paint stays obligingly where you apply it, in a nice thin line. Thinned paint can spread, or worse still (if very thin), flood uncontrollably out of the nib on contact with the model...
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Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
earlswood nob
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by earlswood nob »

Good morning all

Thanks Atlantic, as I wondered if my attempts using thinned acrylics, which spread in all directions, were due to doing something wrong.

Good luck, Jim, in your attempts at lining. Bow pens are sometimes called mapping pens.

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Last edited by earlswood nob on Tue Feb 14, 2023 11:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
MikeTrice
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by MikeTrice »

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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Atlantic 3279 »

A very minor piece of further info, but it may be useful to somebody: My cheap pen was part of such a very basic drawing set that it came with no handle, being only an accessory for a small pair of spring-bow compasses. I wondered what to do about it, but then found that the pen was a nice fit in the largest set of collets in my pin-chuck, pin-vice or "hand held drilling thingy", depending on what you want to call it. That acts as a perfectly practical, comfortable handle, somewhat fatter than the usual handles which is possibly an advantage.
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1

Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

Thank you for the advice and the YouTube links, I'm looking forward to giving a bow pen a go when I get to that phase in my next project

Talking of which.
MkIICoach.jpg
The plan is to repeat the semi-open composite on the top coach while using the bottom coach as a donor coach to turn the middle coach into an all third. (The last is horribly wasteful, but I'm confident I'll be able to use the spare parts on other projects in time)

I decided to experiment with removing the ventilators over the doors first. This was certainly easier, but I won't know if I've left enough material behind until I remove the compartment sides in the next few days. Incidentally I also filed down the raised parts of the roof over the doors on the compartment sides (best seen on the top coach) as I noticed leaving these in place gives the roofline a very raggedy look once the doors are rearranged.

Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by jwealleans »

I also filed down the raised parts of the roof over the doors on the compartment sides (best seen on the top coach) as I noticed leaving these in place gives the roofline a very raggedy look once the doors are rearranged.
I hope you'll reinstate them in the right places. People forget that the cantrail and rain deflectors (that's what the raised pieces are) should be finished in teak brown rather than roof colour and they make a big difference to the appearance of the carriage.
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

jwealleans wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 6:05 am I hope you'll reinstate them in the right places. People forget that the cantrail and rain deflectors (that's what the raised pieces are) should be finished in teak brown rather than roof colour and they make a big difference to the appearance of the carriage.
I would be interested to give it a go, but I’m unsure how best to approach it to be honest.

Particularly as I’d have to retrofit them to some kit built coaches to make the rake match.

Jim
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

While it seemed like a good idea to cut out the ventilators above the door before removing the sides I think I've just caused myself more grief then I saved!
MkIICoachSides.jpg
As you can see more than 50% of the doors will need their upper frame rebuilding anyway. Given the time and effort I invested in cutting out the ventilators, I'd have been better off taking the sides off first and then just removing the top of the door and be done with it!

Well, not all experiments pan out and no real harm done. :D

Unlike the corridor side of the semi-open...I took that off to try to reduce the number of windows from 8 to 7. This seemed practical on paper, but once I got the side off it became obvious that my plan was unworkable and I would have to adjust (i.e. cut and add in a new section into) every window on the side to make it work. That is ALOT of cutting and I have no confidence I could do that to the required level of accuracy, worse it still wouldn't have been completely accurate to the diagram, so I'd have expended a lot of time and effort on something that would have just been wrong in a different manner.

Long story short I decided to put the side back together the way Hornby assembled it and accept that that particular experiment was not a success either. Nice thing is, I imagine on an average day I'll be the only person in the room that knows it is wrong :wink:

Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by jwealleans »

...I’m unsure how best to approach it to be honest.
I use 20 x 20 thou Evergreen strip. Cut to length (slightly wider than the door and then cut to an angle at each end. This is the ECJS vehicle at Shildon, but the principle is the same.

Image

I superglue them onto the top of the cornice and when set I gently file them flush with the cornice edge. The whole thing is then painted teak brown (Humbrol 62). Have a look though the teak carriages thread, there are some decent views in there.
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

After a bit of a delay, I have both coaches up and running (sans one destination board that needs replacing)
Coachs Finished1.jpg
Coaches Finished2.jpg
I had a bit of an issue with the roof line on both coaches and ended up having to rebuild the cantrail (assuming I'm using that right) on one of them so I've not had a go at the rain deflectors this time round. I'll save that for next time as those conversions should leave me with a space side I can practice on first.

There is a bit of a milestone moment though, converting this pair meant that I finaly have a rake where every coach is running on the right sort of bogies and with an at least representative underframe.
Coaches Finished 3.jpg
Also, I'm much happier with the teak colour I managed this time. Found I needed to use a white undercoat or the teak came out darker than I prefer.

Jim de Griz
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

Trying to go for four conversions at once has proven to be a bit of a mistake, every step seems to take longer than the time I have free to dedicate to it which just slows matters down. But, I have finally got the sides back on.

First two are fundamentally repeats of the all third I've previously made (abet one uses the third compartments from a brake coach) and have gone together fairly straight forwardly.
3 All Thirds.jpg
The third was a sleeping car and will hopefully soon be an all third open. I've managed to cut out the original windows relatively neatly, the next job is to fix new panels to form the windows for the all third.
3 Sleeping Car.jpg
I was originally going to build her as a ECJS coach until I realised they were all converted into buffet cars in 1933! Fortunately while I had added windows to the ends, I had some spare ends I could swap in so I can finish the build as later GNR versions. Not entirely wasted effort as I'll need those ends for a future conversion.

Finally the most awkward conversion is to create a Sheffield Stock Brake First.
3 Shefield (2).jpg
I knew this was going to be awkward from the start. Note the small gap in waist panelling I have to fill and the significant ammount of panelling that needs to be replaced above the waist on both sides.
3 Shefield.jpg
Compared to doing that opening up the extra window in the guards compartment seemed simple enough, but proved its own headache as I cut away too much material and had to add filler to shrink the opening. Fortunately I'm actually quite pleased with the way it is coming together so I'm looking forward to the challenge of replacing the panelling rather than dreading it.

This is proving a long phase of the project, but worth it I hope. It will break the back of the overall project as after these four there are only three brake composites left to modify.

Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

Started fitting the missing panels to the All Third. Top lights need a vertical bar to finish them off and I need to add beading, but I thought it best to actually let the sides set firmly before I tried detailing.
3 All Third2.jpg
Jim de Griz
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by Jim de Griz »

Its fair to say I find filling and sanding to be the most challenging part of the build...

All coaches are now sprayed and awaiting painting. The Open Third has its beading complete.
3 All Third3.jpg
While the Sheffield Brake First is now fully assembled
3 Shefield 3.jpg
3 Shefield 4.jpg
New lesson learned, filling and sanding happens before you fit the beading. Doing it the other way round has definately made my life more difficult than it needed to be.

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manna
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Re: Hornby Gresley Coaches into GNR versions

Post by manna »

G'Day Gents

Some very impressive results from 'Old' Hornby coaches, I'm going to give them a go, when I get back into modelling. :D

manna
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