Hattons of Liverpool
Moderators: 52D, Tom F, Rlangham, Atlantic 3279, Blink Bonny, Saint Johnstoun, richard
- strang steel
- LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
- Posts: 2353
- Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 3:54 pm
- Location: From 40F to near 82A via 88C
Hattons of Liverpool
I have just read a rather shocking piece of news.
Apparently Hattons are closing down soon. They have a page outlining the sad details at https://www.hattons.co.uk/newsdetail?id=1498
I always thought they were the most stable of the discount model railway suppliers.
Apparently Hattons are closing down soon. They have a page outlining the sad details at https://www.hattons.co.uk/newsdetail?id=1498
I always thought they were the most stable of the discount model railway suppliers.
John. My spotting log website is now at https://spottinglogs.co.uk/spotting-rec ... s-70s-80s/
- NZRedBaron
- H&BR Q10 0-8-0
- Posts: 196
- Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:58 am
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
It's a solemn and somber moment, that's for certain.
-
- GER D14 4-4-0 'Claud Hamilton'
- Posts: 301
- Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 7:15 pm
- Location: Between a cheap railway station and a ploughed field
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
It does say though that they are closing down as in 'they' decided to close and not they have gone out of business, as in run out of money.
A huge pity though as they were a very visible part of the retail trade and I suggest they helped in the charge that brought a more diverse range of subjects to the market rather than just another iteration of an LNER or LMS Pacific, or a GW Castle or King.
Alan
A huge pity though as they were a very visible part of the retail trade and I suggest they helped in the charge that brought a more diverse range of subjects to the market rather than just another iteration of an LNER or LMS Pacific, or a GW Castle or King.
Alan
Playing trains, but trying to get serious
- Atlantic 3279
- LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
- Posts: 6545
- Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:51 am
- Location: 2850, 245
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
Whilst I think we need to be careful on here to avoid creating a lengthy and largely pointless discussion of the whys and wherefores of Hattons' closure decision, one thing that I'm bearing in mind is this: It is quite possible for a firm to appear "solvent", according to typical accountancy criteria, while it is still trading at the levels shown in latest accounts, in as much as it is then able to pay its way, but it can be a quite different matter if it is decided (or is necessary) to cease or wind-down trading. Various things that could have been paid off over the course of time then have to be settled sooner than expected, and staff may be entitled to considerable amounts of paid notice plus redundancy money. A solvent liquidation won't automatically follow. My experience has been that accountants assuring businesses of their "solvency" do not routinely consider whether the realisable value of the various "assets" is sufficient to cover end-of-business costs. Time alone will tell in this case.
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1
Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
-
- LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
- Posts: 1666
- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2011 3:34 pm
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
So true. But in 'better news', Hattons 2022-23 accounts showed a significant reserve of cash in hand, which if still available should make a solvent wind up of the business achievable.Atlantic 3279 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 11, 2024 9:11 pm ...My experience has been that accountants assuring businesses of their "solvency" do not routinely consider whether the realisable value of the various "assets" is sufficient to cover end-of-business costs. Time alone will tell in this case.
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
Seems odd that they buy out a firm in the US last year, close it and then close themselves.
- NZRedBaron
- H&BR Q10 0-8-0
- Posts: 196
- Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:58 am
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
This is just idle speculation, I must clarify, but maybe they bought MB Klein as a way to diversify their portfolio, only to discover that Klein had unexpected debts that had not been disclosed?
-
- GCR D11 4-4-0 'Improved Director'
- Posts: 456
- Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2006 5:53 am
- Location: Canberra, Australia
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
I am not a model railway enthusiast, but I do find episodes of 'Sam's Trains' to be interesting whenever they pop up on my YouTube feed.
In one of these 'Sam' suggests that Hattons may be getting out while the going is good, preempting a decline in model railways as a hobby as its market declines. As an aside, electric guitar makers in the US such as Fender and Gibson are facing similar difficulties as there is less interest in guitar-based music.
I have noticed that some of the prices for locos appear to be shockingly expensive for the quality on offer and wonder whether this is also having some effect.
In one of these 'Sam' suggests that Hattons may be getting out while the going is good, preempting a decline in model railways as a hobby as its market declines. As an aside, electric guitar makers in the US such as Fender and Gibson are facing similar difficulties as there is less interest in guitar-based music.
I have noticed that some of the prices for locos appear to be shockingly expensive for the quality on offer and wonder whether this is also having some effect.
- Atlantic 3279
- LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
- Posts: 6545
- Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:51 am
- Location: 2850, 245
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
I didn't know they'd shut down the US firm, making its purchase appear pointless. Did they really get fingers burned through lack of adequate prior investigation of the US firm's circumstances?
It appears to me that the majority of business in many sectors are now charging (or attempting to charge) ridiculously increased prices for goods and services which in some cases are no better than they used to be, or which have been loaded up with a lot of un-necessary fancy features/gimmicks that many potential customers will never use and probably do not want. The reasons, or the excuses, for the hugely increased prices are I presume an attempt to regain money actually lost (or allegedly lost) during the pandemic restrictions, the end of unrealistically dirt-cheap borrowing rates, plus the remoaners' "let's blame it for everything" favourite of "Brexit". Whilst I truly sympathise with anybody still forced to try to make a living out of a genuine, honest, hugely over-regulated and statutory-cost burdened small business (I got out in 2020, thankfully), I cannot help thinking that in some cases the modern prices are the result of simple greed, hence the new term I read a while ago of "greedflation" rather than inflation.
If the response of many potential customers to hugely increased prices is the same as mine, i.e. walk away and do without, quite happily, then I can fully understand why Hattons might have decided to get out now.
It appears to me that the majority of business in many sectors are now charging (or attempting to charge) ridiculously increased prices for goods and services which in some cases are no better than they used to be, or which have been loaded up with a lot of un-necessary fancy features/gimmicks that many potential customers will never use and probably do not want. The reasons, or the excuses, for the hugely increased prices are I presume an attempt to regain money actually lost (or allegedly lost) during the pandemic restrictions, the end of unrealistically dirt-cheap borrowing rates, plus the remoaners' "let's blame it for everything" favourite of "Brexit". Whilst I truly sympathise with anybody still forced to try to make a living out of a genuine, honest, hugely over-regulated and statutory-cost burdened small business (I got out in 2020, thankfully), I cannot help thinking that in some cases the modern prices are the result of simple greed, hence the new term I read a while ago of "greedflation" rather than inflation.
If the response of many potential customers to hugely increased prices is the same as mine, i.e. walk away and do without, quite happily, then I can fully understand why Hattons might have decided to get out now.
Most subjects, models and techniques covered in this thread are now listed in various categories on page1
Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
Dec. 2018: Almost all images that disappeared from my own thread following loss of free remote hosting are now restored.
-
- GCR O4 2-8-0 'ROD'
- Posts: 515
- Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:14 pm
- Location: Lincolnshire
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
I'm with you on this one Graeme, whilst over the last 5 years or so there have been some new locomotives that I would love to add to my stable, I can not justify spending the prices asked, hence not having brought a brand new one at allAtlantic 3279 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 27, 2024 11:17 am I didn't know they'd shut down the US firm, making its purchase appear pointless. Did they really get fingers burned through lack of adequate prior investigation of the US firm's circumstances?
It appears to me that the majority of business in many sectors are now charging (or attempting to charge) ridiculously increased prices for goods and services which in some cases are no better than they used to be, or which have been loaded up with a lot of un-necessary fancy features/gimmicks that many potential customers will never use and probably do not want. The reasons, or the excuses, for the hugely increased prices are I presume an attempt to regain money actually lost (or allegedly lost) during the pandemic restrictions, the end of unrealistically dirt-cheap borrowing rates, plus the remoaners' "let's blame it for everything" favourite of "Brexit". Whilst I truly sympathise with anybody still forced to try to make a living out of a genuine, honest, hugely over-regulated and statutory-cost burdened small business (I got out in 2020, thankfully), I cannot help thinking that in some cases the modern prices are the result of simple greed, hence the new term I read a while ago of "greedflation" rather than inflation.
If the response of many potential customers to hugely increased prices is the same as mine, i.e. walk away and do without, quite happily, then I can fully understand why Hattons might have decided to get out now.
Like you, all this DCC stuff isn't my interest, certainly not sound, and the current fashion for flickering fire boxes seams to be someone at design level is trying to recreate their youth from the 80s, it's something that your average person won't see unless you darken the room and turn the lights off
Everything at some point turns up on the second hand market, and you just have to be patient and not get carried away
It's a shame to loose Hattons, but these things happen to bigger brands on the high street (if your town still gas one) and as others have said, if they are getting out now whilst still in a healthy place, then that makes sense
oOo
Brian
Garage Hobbit!!
Modelling in 00 on my heritage line, very GCR inspired
Brian
Garage Hobbit!!
Modelling in 00 on my heritage line, very GCR inspired
- strang steel
- LNER A4 4-6-2 'Streak'
- Posts: 2353
- Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 3:54 pm
- Location: From 40F to near 82A via 88C
Re: Hattons of Liverpool
I agree with these sentiments, and have bought very little stock (except the A5) over the last few years. I had an email from one of the online model shops who I have done business with previously. They seemed excited about the recent Hornby announcements, and so I had a quick look to see if they were going to bring out a B16 or K2 (I know, but there's nothing like a bit of optimism) and one of the first items I saw for pre-order was an 09 shunter.
The price? And I kid you not - £171 - for a diesel shunter!!
I doubt many people can afford to shell out that kind of money these days.
The price? And I kid you not - £171 - for a diesel shunter!!
I doubt many people can afford to shell out that kind of money these days.
John. My spotting log website is now at https://spottinglogs.co.uk/spotting-rec ... s-70s-80s/