Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Tue May 12, 2020 9:34 pm

My slight misgivings about the shade and quality of "teak" I had after phase 4 stemmed from the belief that although the shade in itself was fine, much like some of my earlier models, it wasn't compatible enough with the unintended colour I'd finished up with on the stablemate D.79 vehicle. After due consideration, consultation with the proprietor of West End Workbench, and a couple more test pieces, I added another coat of tinted varnish. In this case, the Precision Teak and dash of black in the previous varnish mixtures was further adulterated with a bit of white. That helped quite noticeably, de-saturating the colour, the opacity of the white also toning down the starker parts of the graining visible in the under-layers. The result was almost what I ideally wanted, and was certainly in-between the "glowing" finish on the Gresley coach and the duller tone on the D.79 that I showed in that four-way comparison image a few days ago. In any case, I had now reached the point at which I thought BUBBLES to the idea of spending any more time on the "teaking" process.
Matters have therefore moved on somewhat, with end plates and paper bellows installed to improve the basic moulded gangways, glazing strips cut and fitted, both ends and one side lined in pale yellow, and almost the full roof paraphernalia now added. I've left a space in the lining out to suit the addition of the words "Restaurant Car" (unless somebody persuades me that such branding was unlikely) and there may be a need to replace a plain gas-lamp chimney at each end of the roof with an oil lamp top. That's what I believe I can see in the photograph of 314, new, at Doncaster, but again, if somebody has information to the contrary, my plan may change.
STA71768.JPG
STA71769m.jpg
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by nzpaul » Tue May 12, 2020 11:02 pm

That's a superb model Graeme, regardless of any niggles you may have with it.

Paul

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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Tue May 12, 2020 11:31 pm

Thanks Paul.

I think some of my misgivings about teak colours arise when comparing an un-lined newly-teaked model with one carrying full lining and transfers. It is always difficult to judge colours effectively when one sample has contrasting decorations and the other is plain. Matching lining styles seem to draw the basic colours together, whether or not there's a true match. Doubtful quality of graining seems to be less obvious when lining is present too. In one way, that must make it even trickier for modellers of unlined teak livery to get the ideal effect.
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Thu May 14, 2020 4:08 pm

My first instinct for the EC D.30 vehicle was to have maximum separation of the words, within the two middle panels, as that would have (just) allowed Restaurant to completely miss the central vertical beading. I then wondered if a big gap, with Car pushed up against the next beading to the right, thus keeping the two widely spaced words centralised within the length of the side, would look odd. I consulted the only three restaurant car pictures in Harris’ Standard Carriages and thought I’d better emulate those, so tried the smaller gap, as per the HMRS sheet, with Restaurant straddling the beading, as in this picture, D.30 lower with D.79 above for comparison. As the latter had to have a GC section number in order to fit anywhere within my supposed modelling scheme, it seems to make sense for the partner D.30 vehicle to have a GC section number too, although GN is equally possible.
STA71772.JPG
My current policy on the spacing of the words is one of masterly indecision.
What do others think?
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teaky
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by teaky » Thu May 14, 2020 5:02 pm

For me, the way you have them positioned in the photo looks natural. A bigger gap between the words would seem unusual and almost suggest they should be read as separate words i.e. "Restaurant. Car." which makes no sense at all.

You could try editing a copy of the photo to see what they look like?

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teaky
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by teaky » Thu May 14, 2020 5:09 pm

Here you go.

It actually looks less odd than I'd imagined but I still prefer the closer spacing.
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diner.jpg

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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by 65447 » Thu May 14, 2020 5:41 pm

Not my specific area of interest but, if you look at pages 106-108 of Michael Harris' original book - Gresley's Coaches, David & Charles - it seems that the letter spacing was such that the gap between each letter within a word was more or less equal to the width of the letters, and that the overall legend was not constrained by vertical beading but that beading which fell within the lettering was simply not lined.

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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Thu May 14, 2020 6:18 pm

Useful input from both of you. Many thanks.
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by mick b » Thu May 14, 2020 6:29 pm

Normal spacing , have you seen the correct size Fox transfers? . Nice work as always.

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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Dave » Thu May 14, 2020 9:34 pm

Graeme.
Checked my lettering drawings, the spacing between restaurant and car varies from approx the length of car to a max of 1'-6".
You might be able to work it out now.

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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Fri May 15, 2020 9:17 am

Thanks to Mick and Dave too, also to Mr Smart and Mr Wealleans for correspondence.

It's a terrible attitude on my part, I know, but although I'm well aware of the recognised superior accuracy of size of the Fox transfers, they are not cheap and I have several good sheets of HMRS LNER transfers, many acquired cheaply or free, whose use maintains consistency of finish with my previous models. Hence I continue to use the less accurate items.

At least they are not spoiling a model here that is perfectly accurate in every other detail....
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by JASd17 » Fri May 15, 2020 10:06 am

Graeme,

I agree that if used as a pair the lettering needs to be the same.

John

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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Wed May 20, 2020 3:05 pm

Time for a catch up. The first two images show the D.30 with transfers applied, both sides as seen in strong daylight and images provided by my temporary access to somebody with a better camera than mine:
IMG_1395lnerf.jpg
IMG_1415lnerf.jpg
I hadn't found time at that stage for one or two additional details, but I have subsequently added door handles and grab handles, window crests in lieu of plain white backings, and a representation at each end of the clerestory roof of what appears to have been an oil lamp top on an otherwise gas-lit carriage. I've added the same to the previous D.79 vehicle too, after re-checking a photograph.
STA71776.JPG
STA71778.JPG
Additionally, I tried adding a thin black line to the top edge and to each side of every mock window in the clerestory, hoping that the illusion of shadow around the edges of slightly recessed glass would be created. It was difficult to get the lines just right, and I simply wasn't impressed by the result, wondering if it enhanced the appearance at all or merely detracted from it. A quick wipe with white spirit restore the status quo ante.
Apart from an eventual choice of couplings, I believe that only weathering of roof, underframe, and a touch of same to the ends now remains to be done, when I get round to it.....
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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by Mercator II » Wed May 20, 2020 4:37 pm

Tidy looking carriage Mr K, soon you will have a rake of them, what with impending retirement!!!!

What's next across your bench?
oOo

Brian

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Re: Atlantic's works: ECJS 12 wheel clerestory dining cars

Post by manna » Wed May 20, 2020 11:04 pm

G'Day Gents

What a beautiful pair of coaches, what must they have looked like in real life, seeing them glide past on the mainline must have a sight to see. Congratulations.

manna
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