Make do and Mend - with multiple girders

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jwealleans
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by jwealleans » Wed Jun 15, 2016 5:18 pm

Toothed quadrant? Have you thought about looking at D-C brake gear etches?

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by drmditch » Sat Jun 18, 2016 1:55 pm

jwealleans wrote:Toothed quadrant? Have you thought about looking at D-C brake gear etches?
I couldn't find this supplier, is it possible you could send me a link?

In the meantime, I've looked at the arrangement on No.1 (which is I think the only Stirling locomotive actually surviving?), a rather hazy picture of a Q1 (sorry GN K1) in Peter Tuffrey's book mentioned above, and the lovely little casting in the cab of Atlantic 3279's model of the same class.

Here is my interpretation.
Post_10.JPG
(I should have included a ruler - it's 17mm high - a scale 4'6". This seems a reasonable height for getting reasonable leverage in case it's 'Armstrong' gear!)

There is an obvious relationship to the gear fitted to the Ivatt engine above, and unless anybody can find evidence of what actually went on Stirling's smaller engines I think I'll fit the one I've made.
Last edited by drmditch on Sat Jun 18, 2016 3:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by drmditch » Sat Jun 18, 2016 2:11 pm

Post_11.JPG
So you've got round to showing me in something like a proper paint job! Well, I suppose black is reasonably dignified, but I remember when I was in that lovely GNR green. This Mr Gresley just doesn't know how to treat engines, not like that lovely Mr Stirling. It's all very well for these great big things flashing all their motion for everyone to see - what do you mean I'm going to get a 'representation' of my internal parts? - that's all very well but I still need my brakes and buffers thank you.

I've got a bone to pick with you. Fancy taking me to visit my eventual home with my springs 1 1/2" down on my driver's side? It hurts I can tell you when you hit your coupling rod oil boxes on the underside of the footplate! You'd better put that right quickly.

Those rear lamp irons look a bit crude. I'd sack the blacksmith if I were you. (Alright, coppersmith. I know you made them out old single-core copper wire beaten flat.) You're a right skinflint you are, but you like hitting things with that little hammer that came from your grandfather.

Post_12.JPG
This black paint certainly shows up all my little blemishes, but I am quite an elderly engine really. At least it's shiny and clean.

What do you mean I'm not going to stay shiny and clean............?
Last edited by drmditch on Sat Jun 18, 2016 3:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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All thumbs
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by All thumbs » Sat Jun 18, 2016 3:15 pm

drmditch wrote:
jwealleans wrote:Toothed quadrant? Have you thought about looking at D-C brake gear etches?
I couldn't find this supplier, is it possible you could send me a kink?
Can't point you towards any etches :( but "D-C brake gear" = Dean Churchward brake gear which appeared on GWR wagon stock 100 years ago. http://www.gwr.org.uk/nowagonbrakes.html will tell you more about this. The third photo on the link shows the ratchet on a DCIII installation which should give you an idea whether a 4mm etch of same will give you what you want or be the basis from which to start.

HTH
Be gentle! Returning to the hobby after more than 20 years away...

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by drmditch » Sat Jun 18, 2016 8:49 pm

Thank you. I understand the 'D-C' bit now. I've tried to model a GWR van with this a few years ago. How complicated these Swindon people can get.
I don't think 'toothed' is quite the word for this quadrant:-
Post_10a.jpg
Those retaining blocks must about 1 to 1 1/2" high do you think?
Post_10b.jpg
The pedestal (if that is the right word) is quite tall, but the operating height of the handle is about the same level as the regulator. This is the same on the Q1s I think, so I've reduced the pedestal height but kept the operating height the same. Of course, this is all conjecture and I might be quite wrong!

LNER4479
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by LNER4479 » Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:11 pm

drmditch wrote:
The attachment Post_11.JPG is no longer available
So you've got round to showing me in something like a proper paint job! Well, I suppose black is reasonably dignified, but I remember when I was in that lovely GNR green. This Mr Gresley just doesn't know how to treat engines, not like that lovely Mr Stirling. It's all very well for these great big things flashing all their motion for everyone to see - what do you mean I'm going to get a 'representation' of my internal parts? - that's all very well but I still need my brakes and buffers thank you.

This black paint certainly shows up all my little blemishes, but I am quite an elderly engine really. At least it's shiny and clean.

What do you mean I'm not going to stay shiny and clean............?
... at least I'm a distinct improvement for the duty compared to the present incumbent - he can't even keep his coupling rods in line!
IMG_6900_LR.jpg
'Robert' (the Devil)
(recreating pre-war Grantham in model form http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9076. Forthcoming exhibition appearances: Wakefield (Nov 2018), St Evenage (Jan 2019), Spalding (Nov 2019)

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by drmditch » Wed Aug 03, 2016 9:52 pm

So, I'm finished now am I ? That's all you're going to do?

Post_13a.JPG
You could have taken a better picture of me. You said you were going to wait for sunshine. Well I don't think you're not showing me at my best.

Yes I've got my brakes and buffers and coupling hooks, and at last you've given me a front top lamp-iron. I suppose I have to have those fire-irons on the fireman's side of the footplate - but why is that bucket just in front of the cab? Honestly, just because someone took a picture of me with a bucket in that position in 1930, I don't see why you have to put one there now. But - I suppose if it makes you happy!

You did work hard on my brake pull rods, after all they are quite a feature of my design aren't they, but you've left a lot of distance between my brake blocks and my wheels. What do you mean it's sensible clearances? They worked to closer tolerances in Doncaster I can tell you. I don't believe what you told me on Monday after your trip down to KX, about Doncaster works not being there any more.

Post_13b.JPG
You seem to have managed most of my controls. I've got a pull out regulator, and a nice reversing lever, and that handbrake is more-or-less in the right place, and at the correct angle to. No - I am totally unable to explain why it doesn't get jammed with coal. Do you think I've got eyes in the back of my head?

Why can't I go for a nice long run down the main line; just to get nicely run in. What do you mean there are bridges missing. I'd sack your Engineer if I were you. Oh - so you are the Engineer as well. I wondered what you were doing with those sheets of plywood. Isn't a bit late in the day for wooden viaducts?

By-the-way, what's that horrible thing under my rear buffer beam? You seemed to spend a lot of time adjusting it. Coupling? Why can't I just use proper three link ones as I always used to?

So now you've fitted my front sand pipes curving round inside my front brakes (to tell you the truth that was never good engineering really) and now you're not going to do any more?

Really? - But what about...... Please.... if I ask very nicely.........
Last edited by drmditch on Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

LNER4479
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Re: Make do and Mend - still south of Shaftholme

Post by LNER4479 » Thu Aug 04, 2016 5:09 pm

Mmmmmmm! Looks mighty fine to me :D

I'll have my camera ready in case you come trundling by...
'Robert' (the Devil)
(recreating pre-war Grantham in model form http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9076. Forthcoming exhibition appearances: Wakefield (Nov 2018), St Evenage (Jan 2019), Spalding (Nov 2019)

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - meanwhile - back in the NE Area

Post by drmditch » Fri Aug 05, 2016 6:56 pm

The little engine has now gone down the line (It should be 'up the line' really). It seemed to enjoy it's romp on the Down ECML and hopefully it will now settle down to be a really useful engine.

Despite making slow progress with my own line, one or two other smaller projects have been able to proceed.

Here is one - all the way from China!
Post_Q6_06.JPG
There is a full description ... here ... and scroll down....

This is actually one of the best RTR models I have purchased, although I do like my 04 and 06 and 07 and..... well several others really.

There is also another locomotive, but before it can be photographed it needs a small problem with clear-drying adhesive that wasn't clear-drying to be rectified.

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - meanwhile - back in the NE Area

Post by drmditch » Wed Nov 09, 2016 11:16 am

Just to add a finishing touch to the above-mentioned J54, here is a splendid picture by Tony Wright (re-posted with permission) of 3637A in her now usual home!
post-18225-0-09129300-1473933313.jpg
If you haven't yet seen the utterly splendid Grantham layout, with it's (at this point one runs out of suitable laudatory adjectives) signalling and variety and range of rolling stock, then do attempt to get to the NEC later this month. Do give yourself enough time though. There is always something more to see on this railway.

(Compliments as usual to LNER4479, and Jwealleans, Atlantic 3279, and all the rest of the team)

The only problem with Mr Wright's photography is that it shows all the things I got wrong, left off, or could have done better! However, it is quite a little engine, and there is no RTR or (as far as I know) kit equivalent. Of course, if I was starting again........ but hindsight is always easy!
Last edited by drmditch on Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - meanwhile - back in the NE Area

Post by drmditch » Wed Nov 09, 2016 11:43 am

Now, back to mundanity and my own workbench.

While I'm re-building my railway (a thread for that is on the 'other' website .....here..... , I've been unable to resist working on some rolling stock and tacking some of the contents of my kit box.

There has been a lot of information posted recently about cattle wagons. I did build one of the Parkside kits for a 9' wheelbase LNER wagon some time ago, and it looks pretty enough in the background, but I could have done better with the underframe. There were two more of these in the box, and here is the first one.
Post_03.JPG
This has been rebuilt to the 10' wheelbase version (with many thanks to Steve Banks for his most useful website and of course Peter Tatlow's Volume 4b).
This picture 'in-the-plastic' shows most of what has been done. It needs to be tidied up a bit before painting. I've utilised the Parkside solebars by chopping them in half, adding a 4mm insert, and then reducing each end by 2mm. This technique does preserve most of the moulded detail in the correct (?) place.

A second one is in course of construction :-
Post_01.JPG
This shows one of the trickiest parts of this build, which is getting the clasp brakes into their new position. To avoid chopping the floor moulding about too much (and thus reducing it's strength) the brake shoe moulding has the notch on the 'outside' corner increased in length, and then a re-inforcement piece of pastic added. This also has the advantage of getting the brake shoes in line with the wheels.

in the picture the LH piece is the original, the centre one is 'as notched' and the RH one as re-inforced. Do remember that these will need to be 'handed'!

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - meanwhile - back in the NE Area

Post by drmditch » Wed Nov 09, 2016 11:58 am

However, my railway (circa 1938/1947) will need more than LNER designed wagons. (See Mr Banks' website and the threads on here for more discussion.)

Some years ago I lengthened an old Mainline/Bachmann 'short' wagon into a representation of an LMS Dia 1840 vehicle, and there are a number more in a box to be likewise modified. However, in the meantime Parkside have produced their very nice kit for a Dia 1661 cattle wagon. (Mr Whealleans has already posted a picture of his build of one of these.

It is an excellent kit, with crisp and sharp mouldings, and goes together very well. However, I wasn't happy with my ability to get the diagonal re-inforcing straps correct, particularly at the upper/outer end. So my first attempt was built as:-
Post_02a.jpg
This is the later build showing the reinforcing plates as used on Dia 1840 as well. (Thanks to Mr Essery's LMS Wagons Vol.1)

I have also built one without these plates, but I didn't like the way the picture came out. It might be better to make the straps out of brass, and I may modify my second model accordingly.

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - meanwhile - back in the NE Area

Post by drmditch » Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:18 pm

There is also, of course, the Oxford model of a 9' wheelbase wagon!
Post_04.JPG
Without wishing to enter any of the controversy about this model, I did not find it too difficult to modify (to my expectations and standards at least.)
The side shown has the misplaced planking cut out with a sharp scalpel blade and replaced the 'other way round', with a re-inforcing plate on the inside.
It is now virtually impossible to see the scars!

Other than that, the top notched plank was added on both sides, a vacuum cylinder added, and the vacuum pipe on one end swapped from one side to the other.

The feature of the model I most dislike is the shade of sand/brown livery and the (fictitious?) number. Even with my usual heavy weathering it still shows through, and I think this model may yet need more work.

However, the selling price (depending on the sales outlet) is not far different from the Parkside kit, and the time required to modify the Oxford version is much less than (for me at least) building the kit. On the 'other forum' one clever person has modifed the Oxford version to a 10' wheelbase vehicle, and I might yet be tempted to do the same.

There are also some other cattle wagon projects/conversions that I have in mind

In the meantime however, in addition to more of the LMS vehicles, and Parkside has shown up the inadequacy of my earlier conversion, I also have two of the 51L NER medium Cattle Wagons to make, and I haven't assembled a white metal wagon for some time.

It will be interesting to see if I can remember how to do it!
Last edited by drmditch on Thu Nov 10, 2016 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Atlantic 3279
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Re: Make do and Mend - meanwhile - back in the NE Area

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Wed Nov 09, 2016 1:09 pm

I think I would have cut and shut the solebars as you did to change the lengths too. The knock-on effects on the brake shoe fittings are just one of those annoying little challenges that goes with the job of "interfering" with models in unintended ways.....
Bachmann A2 to A2/3: from my thread in Model Railways page 56 to 83, also

Hornby A3 to A1/1 Great Northern: from page 84, in resin from page 108.


Apologies for so many missing images - see page 1 for reasons & possible solution.

drmditch
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Re: Make do and Mend - meanwhile - back in the NE Area

Post by drmditch » Wed Nov 09, 2016 7:24 pm

Atlantic 3279 wrote:I think I would have cut and shut the solebars as you did to change the lengths too. The knock-on effects on the brake shoe fittings are just one of those annoying little challenges that goes with the job of "interfering" with models in unintended ways.....
Thank you. The main advantage of treating the solebars in this way is that one can use the moulded sockets for the w-irons and the V hangers, and if one is careful (I marked up a little jig) then everything stays square and running is unaffected. The brake rigging needs additional work, but what is supplied with the kit is a bit basic anyway. (I think it's a fairly old kit by now, and not Parkside in origin.)

The photographs show that there is quite a lot of tidying up to do before painting. A new scalpel blade may be needed to trim my plastic bolts to length!

Not sure about 'interfering'. I use kits/RTR models or anything else suitable to help me make what I want to make. (Subject to the limits of my skills and abilities.) I don't think that there's anything wrong in that is there?

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