Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

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S.A.C. Martin
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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by S.A.C. Martin » Sat Nov 23, 2019 10:08 pm

Excellent news. That means I can buy a GNR style one and not feel guilty about the second hand one I took apart for my P1 build.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by Phil » Sat Nov 23, 2019 11:00 pm

Brilliant news indeed (and on the 7th anniversary of the first post on this thread! :D) Good to see the numbering suggestion for the O2/2 taken on board. Order for 3501 duly placed. Pre WW2 era now covered. Thanks to all concerned.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by manna » Sun Nov 24, 2019 9:17 pm

teaky wrote:
Sat Nov 23, 2019 9:12 pm
Heljan have decided to go ahead with further versions of the O2.

Versions:
3900 LNER black ‘O2/2’ No. 3501 with low running plate, GN cab and tender
3902 BR early emblem ‘O2/2’ No. 63933 with low running plate, GN cab and tender
3903 BR late crest ‘O2/2’ No. 63940 with low running plate, GN cab and GNR tender, short chimney
3930 GNR lined grey ‘O2/1’ No. 477 with low running plate, GN cab and tender, tall chimney
3931 LNER black ‘O2/1’ No. 3481 with low running plate, GN cab and tender, tall chimney
3940 LNER black ‘O2/4’ No. 3485 with low running plate, side window cab and GNR tender, short chimney
3942 BR early emblem black ‘O2/4' No. 63945 with low running plate, GN cab and tender, short chimney
3943 BR early emblem black ‘O2/4’ No. 63932 with low running plate, side window cab and GN tender, short chimney

Features:
· Now with Great Northern cab and tender options
· O2/1, O2/2 and O2/4 variants
· Detailed footplate and cab
· Sprung Buffers
· Authentic boiler, cab, tender, chimney and running plate variations
· Wire handrails
· DCC and Sound Ready
· Expected Q4 2020
G'Day Gents

Merry 'Bl**dy' Christmas, Hallelujah.

manna
EDGWARE GN, Steam in the Suburbs.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by john coffin » Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:11 am

4th item on the list is wrong.
Highly unlikely that GNR grey and lettering would have survived from WW1 to post 1923.

Probably more accurate as 390

paul

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by Phil » Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:23 am

john coffin wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:11 am
4th item on the list is wrong.
Highly unlikely that GNR grey and lettering would have survived from WW1 to post 1923.

Probably more accurate as 390

paul
Looking up RCTS vol.6B and Yeadon vol.9 suggests that 477-486 were all built (or ex-works) in May 1921 and all were in GNR lined grey. 484 was the first to go into black on 23rd Jan 1923 to evaluate that particular livery option after the LNER came into being. 477 went in for its first general repair on 20th March 1923 from which it emerged on 16th July. Probably safe to assume it was then painted black as 477N. It became 3477 in July 1925.

So the Heljan model is OK for the fairly narrow modelling window of 5/21 to 3/23. Earlier posts in this thread suggest that the cab will be the same 'GNR style' cab fitted to O2/2 rather than pure GNR. Noting that Heljan are taking the trouble to offer both short and tall chimney styles I wonder if they have reconsidered the variant cab options. I might still be tempted by 477 if so.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:03 pm

3481?????

Snap!
STA70382 lnerf.jpg


I've had one of those for a while now, although I admit the running plate is the unaltered high version. For a little bit of work and very little money, others eagerly waiting could have had an O2/1 long before now too.
I trust that Heljan will be paying proper attention to the fact that the O2/1 and O2/2 versions of the wrap-over cab are most definitely not the same. I wonder if there will be any improvements to eradicate the splayed-out rear ends of the slidebars, well out-of-gauge motion bracket, wrongly placed joint between eccentric rod and expansion link, and the flimsily attached expansion link itself?
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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by ROY@34F » Mon Nov 25, 2019 2:03 pm

Good news indeed. It would be nice if improvements were made as Graeme (atlantic 3279) says , regarding the slidebars and motion brackets , valve gear discrepancies , and the GN cab shapes .

Roy.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by mick b » Mon Nov 25, 2019 3:12 pm

Indeed buyer beware !!!.
Heljan again!!! , the name seems to come with a disaster attached on all of their steam efforts.
Beyer Garrett, Night Hawk, O2 , Narrow gauge Exe and now the O gauge A3 and the forth coming A4 , all have had either total failure,falling to bits valve gear on all the versions, and missing/poorly made parts , strange designs especially on the O2, and even missing lining on the Apple Green livery on the LNER A3 versions.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by Brush53Falcon » Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:01 pm

manna wrote:
Sun Nov 24, 2019 9:17 pm
teaky wrote:
Sat Nov 23, 2019 9:12 pm
Heljan have decided to go ahead with further versions of the O2.

Versions:
3900 LNER black ‘O2/2’ No. 3501 with low running plate, GN cab and tender
3902 BR early emblem ‘O2/2’ No. 63933 with low running plate, GN cab and tender
3903 BR late crest ‘O2/2’ No. 63940 with low running plate, GN cab and GNR tender, short chimney
3930 GNR lined grey ‘O2/1’ No. 477 with low running plate, GN cab and tender, tall chimney
3931 LNER black ‘O2/1’ No. 3481 with low running plate, GN cab and tender, tall chimney
3940 LNER black ‘O2/4’ No. 3485 with low running plate, side window cab and GNR tender, short chimney
3942 BR early emblem black ‘O2/4' No. 63945 with low running plate, GN cab and tender, short chimney
3943 BR early emblem black ‘O2/4’ No. 63932 with low running plate, side window cab and GN tender, short chimney

Features:
· Now with Great Northern cab and tender options
· O2/1, O2/2 and O2/4 variants
· Detailed footplate and cab
· Sprung Buffers
· Authentic boiler, cab, tender, chimney and running plate variations
· Wire handrails
· DCC and Sound Ready
· Expected Q4 2020
G'Day Gents

Merry 'Bl**dy' Christmas, Hallelujah.

manna
Good Evening All
I'm glad I've been able to rejoin this thread after a considerable absence but hope that I can contribute and take on any comments regarding the announcement of the new versions of the O2.
Firstly can I correct the description of #3942, this should read LNER side window cab as of course it is an O2/4.
Also #3943 is misquoted as it will have a late BR crest as shown in the new catalogue.
We have requested improvements to valve gear, motion bracket, draw-bar and associated wiring to tender, and requested blackened handrails and brass handrail knobs. Improvements will also be made to the cab side sheeting (LNER profile) of the GN cab but it must be emphasised that most of the existing tooling will be used as it is already in place.
There will be a shorter production run on all of these.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by strang steel » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:03 am

This is a great announcement, and one I was not expecting. And I will have enough time to save up for two or three of the new variants. :D

Thanks very much Heljan.


63939 at Retford © Colour-rail
63939 retford.jpg
John

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by Atlantic 3279 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:34 am

You can't claim to be properly portraying an O2/1, such as 3481, if the loco has the LNER version of the GN cab, with low eaves and large spectacle apertures with curved inner edges. It would be far more honest to state that such a model is what it is - an O2/2.The original GN cab has definitely noticeable higher eaves (and therefore flatter roof) and smaller spectacles with straight, sloping, inner edges.
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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by strang steel » Tue Nov 26, 2019 1:56 pm

"Expected Q4 2020"

And by that time Peco may have released a bullhead single slip :shock: - and it will be all systems go for me at last.
John

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by Hatfield Shed » Tue Nov 26, 2019 2:31 pm

mick b wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 3:12 pm
Indeed buyer beware !!!. Heljan again!!! , the name seems to come with a disaster attached on all of their steam efforts...
I feel that to qualify for 'disaster', bursting into flames and destroying part of a layout - or some equivalent - would be required. Okay, I only have an O2/3 and O2/4, and one friend (with an unaccountable taste for LMR) with a garratt, as the sum total of my Heljan steam model experience, but these have been operationally trouble free so far, and I run mine a lot.

Positives for the O2:
undoubtedly looks like an O2 ('gets the character of the subject' in common with most OO RTR locos),
amongst the most smooth running OO RTR steam locos I own,
best traction of any other OO RTR maker's current 2-8-0 that I have compared to (O1, O4, O7, 8F, 28xx),
the finer flanges; really shows to advantage, particularly on the pony truck wheelset.

Negatives:
'unfriendly' mechanism construction (I intend to apply slight periodic exterior lubrication and otherwise leave alone!),
detail errors and omissions requiring correction (few RTR OO models free from this shortcoming),
fragile applied detail (again not uncommon in RTR OO so put on track and left there, avoiding handling).

The major strike against is the mechanism construction. Compared to the neat and easily worked on layout of their twin bogie traction, way inferior. Surely Heljan have the knowledge to match other maker's product in this respect? 'Could do better' would be my overall assessment: but a lot less trouble than building a kit to equivalent appearance and running standard.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by mick b » Tue Nov 26, 2019 4:44 pm

Hatfield Shed wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 2:31 pm
mick b wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 3:12 pm
Indeed buyer beware !!!. Heljan again!!! , the name seems to come with a disaster attached on all of their steam efforts...
I feel that to qualify for 'disaster', bursting into flames and destroying part of a layout - or some equivalent - would be required. Okay, I only have an O2/3 and O2/4, and one friend (with an unaccountable taste for LMR) with a garratt, as the sum total of my Heljan steam model experience, but these have been operationally trouble free so far, and I run mine a lot.

Positives for the O2:
undoubtedly looks like an O2 ('gets the character of the subject' in common with most OO RTR locos),
amongst the most smooth running OO RTR steam locos I own,
best traction of any other OO RTR maker's current 2-8-0 that I have compared to (O1, O4, O7, 8F, 28xx),
the finer flanges; really shows to advantage, particularly on the pony truck wheelset.

Negatives:
'unfriendly' mechanism construction (I intend to apply slight periodic exterior lubrication and otherwise leave alone!),
detail errors and omissions requiring correction (few RTR OO models free from this shortcoming),
fragile applied detail (again not uncommon in RTR OO so put on track and left there, avoiding handling).

The major strike against is the mechanism construction. Compared to the neat and easily worked on layout of their twin bogie traction, way inferior. Surely Heljan have the knowledge to match other maker's product in this respect? 'Could do better' would be my overall assessment: but a lot less trouble than building a kit to equivalent appearance and running standard.
I must be very unlucky with the dismal effort I bought, a almost totally rebuild repairing the valve gear , replace all the handrails and plastic knobs, added extra detail and filled gaps in the Tender Coal plate, and then finally repainted (if there was ever any paint other than red on the whole loco). :roll: :roll:

Your plus points are actually not very high compared to the down points either. It looks like a O2 ? , other than the side Cab windows are far too deep, front cab windows a weird shape and is the Chimney is the wrong shape. :shock: :shock

If you compare it with the cheaper Hornby Thompson O1 and Raven Q6 and Bachmann O4 it is nowhere near the quality of any of those Locos.

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Re: Heljan Gresley O2 2-8-0 'Tango'

Post by Hatfield Shed » Tue Nov 26, 2019 6:21 pm

There is always room for perceptions to vary. Had I encountered such a wreck as your O2; tout suite, returned to vendor. Any detail stuff that jabs me in the eye I can get to work on and have done so. My priorities are weighted toward operation, good running performance will see much else forgiven.

The comparisons:
The superior appearance of Hornby's O1 and the conventional mechanism is preferred, but it lacked traction partly because the fall plate rested rigidly on the tender step (adjusted) and having too little weight In the loco (weight added).
Bachmann's O4, conventional mechanism is preferred but too light for traction (weight added) wider footplate section over cylinders too long, cylinders too steeply inclined (corrected).
Neither as smooth running as the Heljan, but DCC sorts that out.
Don't have a Q6 to make the comparison, but that has had motor troubles fairly frequently reported.

In my ideal world I would have all the benchmark features combined in every RTR model; but am prepared to compromise for the relatively small price and choice, and fiddle around to correct any perceived deficiencies.

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