Norwich or maybe China?

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Percy Main
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Norwich or maybe China?

Post by Percy Main »

Image
Can anyone help me identify this station from c 1910? I thought it might be Norwich (but I am afraid it might be somewhere in China).
65447
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by 65447 »

It's not Norwich (Thorpe) or any of the other stations in the city...
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Percy Main
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by Percy Main »

The photo is by an artist and amateur photographer who lived in Norwich. It's from a small collection apparently recording a journey he made to Manchuria and Korea by rail. The platform height and small engine in the centre suggest (to me) this is in England. Could it be an East Anglian coastal port? Are those GER signals?
Last edited by Percy Main on Wed Jul 27, 2016 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
jwealleans
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by jwealleans »

What rolling stock is visible doesn't look like anything I'm familiar with in the UK. British influenced, maybe, but not quite right. I'd be inclined to go along with the idea this is overseas, maybe a colony but not even that, necessarily.
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by 65447 »

The biggest clue to it being overseas is the lack of any company initials on the visible rolling stock.

If you can give me a name for the individual I can pass the query on to a member of the Norfolk Railway Society, where someone may already be au fait with them and/or their photographs.
John Palmer
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by John Palmer »

What struck me about the picture was that the track gauge appeared too narrow for standard gauge - which would tend to rule out Chinese railways or the South Manchurian Railway. Looking for another possibility I gravitated towards a station on the Japanese system, where the 'narrow', 3' 6" gauge is/was in widespread use.

Eventually I came up with a picture of Osaka's second station at http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5045/520 ... 2e6d_z.jpg. Built in 1901, it's the right period for the OP's picture and bears a substantial resemblance to the building towards the left hand side.

After further examination, I'm the more convinced this is Osaka because the roof features and position of the building on the right of my linked photograph correspond very closely with those of the left-hand most building in the OP's picture.
giner
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by giner »

Stunning detective work there, Mr. Palmer. :shock:
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richard
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by richard »

...and Japan is known for originally following British practice.
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52D
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by 52D »

giner wrote:Stunning detective work there, Mr. Palmer. :shock:
seconded.
Hi interested in the area served by 52D. also researching colliery wagonways from same area.
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Percy Main
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by Percy Main »

Stunning indeed and thank you Mr Palmer. I am convinced.

My records do not actually show the photographer in Osaka, but he was certainly in nearby Kobe in December 1908. He sailed from Yokohama (which would have involved travelling through Osaka) in January 1909. So we have a place and a date (within a few weeks).
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kimballthurlow
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by kimballthurlow »

Hi,
Yes I agree. Living in Queensland, the 3'6" gauge looks familiar.

What I would like to know if possible, is how the photo was coloured.

regards
Kimball
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by Hatfield Shed »

Hand tinting of monochrome originals was a well developed art ahead of direct colour photography. We have several among the family photo albums from about the 1900s on. (Sadly nothing interesting, just the folks...) It was quite expensive even as DIY because a large set of dyes were required if you were aiming for a reasonably realistic result. So much at least from my grandfather (b.1883) who was the family member with the skill. On the positive side, you could practice on a couple of prints to select the best tints for the desired end result, before going for the finished piece.
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kimballthurlow
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by kimballthurlow »

Hi Hatfield Shed,
Thanks for the explanation about tinting, very good.

regards
Kimball
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StevieG
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Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by StevieG »

Hatfield Shed wrote:
kimballthurlow wrote: .... What I would like to know if possible, is how the photo was coloured.

regards
Kimball "
Hand tinting of monochrome originals was a well developed art ahead of direct colour photography. We have several among the family photo albums from about the 1900s on. (Sadly nothing interesting, just the folks...) It was quite expensive even as DIY because a large set of dyes were required if you were aiming for a reasonably realistic result. So much at least from my grandfather (b.1883) who was the family member with the skill. On the positive side, you could practice on a couple of prints to select the best tints for the desired end result, before going for the finished piece.
... And, kimballthurlow, there are the amazing modern digital possibilities of achieving this, as demonstrated in the "LNER Photographs and Videos" forum herein, by Darwin4975 in his (so far) 2.5 years-long thread "Computer Coloured Monochrome" -

- ( viewtopic.php?f=15&t=9343 ).
BZOH

/
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/// \ \ \ \
Mickey

Re: Norwich or maybe China?

Post by Mickey »

StevieG wrote:
Hatfield Shed wrote:
kimballthurlow wrote: .... What I would like to know if possible, is how the photo was coloured.

regards
Kimball "
Hand tinting of monochrome originals was a well developed art ahead of direct colour photography. We have several among the family photo albums from about the 1900s on. (Sadly nothing interesting, just the folks...) It was quite expensive even as DIY because a large set of dyes were required if you were aiming for a reasonably realistic result. So much at least from my grandfather (b.1883) who was the family member with the skill. On the positive side, you could practice on a couple of prints to select the best tints for the desired end result, before going for the finished piece.
... And, kimballthurlow, there are the amazing modern digital possibilities of achieving this, as demonstrated in the "LNER Photographs and Videos" forum herein, by Darwin4975 in his (so far) 2.5 years-long thread "Computer Coloured Monochrome" -

- ( viewtopic.php?f=15&t=9343 ).
Funny enough I wrote out a whole post about the photograph being a colour photograph for such a early time circa 1909 but decided not to post it last week due to going 'off topic' but I heard a radio programme on BBC radio 4 about 2 years ago that was talking about the history of colour photography and from memory the earliest colour photograph (not using tinting) in the UK dates from around 1901-02 the photograph being of a London street scene on a sunny day, another early colour photograph is of a group of young and older people at London Zoo around 1904 and a third colour photograph is of a woman in Hyde park again on a sunny day in 1907.

As could be expected the colour process in colour photography at that early time was so expensive it wasn't viable for commercial use until decades later.

Mickey
Last edited by Mickey on Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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