Caledonian Road Goods Depot

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Mickey
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by Mickey » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:45 pm

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Last edited by Mickey on Thu Oct 26, 2017 10:46 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by swhite01 » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:12 am

I have a line diagram covering Kings Cross Goods, the drawing is dated, with a printed note by the scale as "lines correct at 1933", it has a printed owner stamp "S & T" but unforutnately no written date. My images are too large to attach so I have included a link to the photos below.Unfortunately it does not cover the the Goods Depot itself, but hope this helps. The area covered by the Drawing is the Kings Cross goods complex and the running lines between the tunnels.

Steve

http://www.flickr.com/photos/8336963@N0 ... 577139716/

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StevieG
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by StevieG » Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:39 am

Many thanks for what's at the other end of that link Steve; most interesting.

I note on the plan, the absence of G & M No.6 crossover points ("Up Coal" facing, to Down Coal) mostly below the N.London line overbridge/viaduct. This crossover facilitated Up goods trains running straight into 'the North Yard' (Nos. 3-8 Arch Sidings), for which, on the Up home signals gantry at the exit from Copenhagen Tunnel, the signals governing these moves (to No.3 OR to No.8 sidings only) were the right-hand pair of arms Nos. 2 & 4, mounted vertically one above the other on the one doll.
Similarly, in the group of four G & M Up Distant signals which stood beside the Up Goods flyover at Holloway, south of Caledonian Road bridge, the right-hand pair, Nos. 1 & 3, again vertically-mounted, applied for these routes.

I wonder if these points were genuinely not there in 1933, or it's just an uninentional drawing office omission.


I also see that the line titled latterly as the Down South London Goods line (rose from the main line at the N. end of Gasworks Tunnel) is named, possibly more appropriately, as Down Engine And Emergency Road on your diagram, a name I had not previously heard of: It certainly would have been used, unsurprisingly, by locos from KX station for Top Shed, but could be used, as evident by the track layout on your diagram, as a through running route for trains onward to Holloway - even, as far as non-passenger trains were concerned, with no prior arrangements or special working method.

I recall one c1969 morning when I was present, that KX box desired to despatch three trains simultaneously, utilising the Down South London Goods line.
At that time, the three Down lines through Gasworks (D Main 1, DM2, & D Slow) merged into two passenger lines (D Fast & DS) from Belle Isle forward to Holloway, but with points connections from DM1 and DS to the DSLG, so this was undoubtedly not a rare occurrence, but probably wasn't that frequent either I think: Quite possibly no trains were even timetabled to run this way, via the DSLG.

But on this occasion an ECS train (must have been decided to depart KX on the DS) was offered to Goods & Mineral on the block bell, accepted, and signalled on to Holloway South Down box, and all signals cleared, thus forming the third clear Down route to Holloway, roughly in parallel with the other two trains, which ran DM1-DF, and DM2-DS, and onwards to Holloway.
When the 'Lickey' connection from G & M down to Copenhagen Junction box still existed, used primarily for locos from Top Shed to KX station, Cop. box had a full size signal arm on it for reaching the Down Slow (from where locos reversed to the engine line to Belle Isle Up box: That line was quaintly named the Up South London Goods), so conceivably, should unusual circumstances have required it, it appears that a train from KX could also have been routed via the D SL Goods, but then down the 'Lickey' and back out onto the Down Slow.
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StevieG
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by StevieG » Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:20 pm

A few c1969/70 images to give a flavour of the area at Goods & Mineral Junction :
[ All photos in posts by StevieG within this thread, are by Steve Gwinnett unless otherwise attributed. ]:

View north from G & M Box.
scan.Color Goods&Min, vw to Copenh'n.goods Tnl.from G&M Box (early morn'g) 800dpi(brightened,+deeper contrast).jpg
View south from G & M Box
scan.Color Goods&Min Box, view south from box(early morn'g) 1200dpi('Auto-Brightnssd' & midtones to +100)(comprssd).jpg
...To be supplemented below (hopefully) ....

[ Edited 22:52 & 22:54, 13/06/13; only to add info. on photograph attributions.]
Last edited by StevieG on Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:54 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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strang steel
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by strang steel » Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:47 pm

Two fascinating photos. Thanks very much for posting them.

I am beginning to understand the complex nature of operations at this location now.
John

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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by StevieG » Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:21 pm

I intended there would be 5 or 6 images in my most recent post herein but I'm strangely having incredible difficulty with the forum's machinations (misbehaviour?) in just trying to make simple attachments of images (which I have done before without problem), including already attached photos being duplicate-attached when trying to attach another image.
The only way to get any of them posted was to temporarily curtail efforts and just post the first two.

Carrying on struggling with the rest as additional post(s) but not sure how long the will to do so will last.

Watch this space .....
Last edited by StevieG on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by StevieG » Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:44 pm

.... continued from my 13:20 post of today (still c1969/70) ....

View south from cutting/embankment beside the line to 'Caledonian' yard, about 50 yards south of Copenhagen Tunnel, Goods lines bore portal. [ Who says that model railway track has to be straight or only curve gentle/gracefully to accurately replicate the prototype? ]
scan.B&W of Color Goods&Min, view south from retain'g wall, by n-western Shunt Spur 1200dpi('Auto-Brightnss'd & Midtones to +100)(comprssd).jpg
View south from above Goods lines bore of Copenhagen Tunnel.
scan.B&W of Color Goods&Min, view south from above Copenh'h GL Tunnel 1200dpi('Auto-Brightnss'd & midtones to +100)(comprssd).jpg
Whatever the actual date of these four photos, it will be seen in at least two, that the track up to the 'Caledonian' yard had been lifted.


... Well that seems to be it folks. Seems that, somewhat mystified, I can't attach the last two photos (typical size 197KB) at all.
I reckon 3.5 hours is enough to spend on something that ought to be fairly simple when it's worked okay before
Last edited by StevieG on Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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StevieG
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by StevieG » Thu Mar 21, 2013 5:29 pm

[ .... Managed it after all, somehow (I think/hope!) ] ..... continued from my earlier posts herein of 13:20 and 14:44 today .....


c1969/70 general view south from the North London line, of the area around Goods & Mineral Junction box. Amongst the many things that could be described; the line up behind the box is seen to have already become trackless, down its curving fall to pass through No.9 Arch of York Way road viaduct. And the gap between tracks seen left-of-centre had contained the Down Engine Line from KX Top Shed: Nos. 1 & 2 arches of the viaduct are also devoid of track in the background - The track immediately left of the gap, which mainly served as the former Up Engine Line, remains but only to pass through 'E' arch of the original viaduct section and serve the New Reception roads beyond.
scan.Color Goods&Min, (stitched images) KX Goods Yd Arr-Dep.lines, North Yd, Cal'l line & NL Incline from N.London Lines bdg (early morn'g) 800dpi (DeeprCntrst.jpg
And finally; - Courtesy of, and with full acknowledgement to/credit for capturing it, to Mr. F.Cheevers, then Modernisation Inspector,
this early-1970s view south, isof the south portal and beyond of Copenhagen Tunnel's Goods lines' bore, including Goods & Mineral box's prominent Up homes gantry: Photo taken from the rear of the brake van of one of the Electrification engineers' trains, as it headed away from their then temporary 'base' in the Goods yard.
(not scan'd) Colour Goods&Min from brake van in Copenh'n Tnl.  FC.jpg
Last edited by StevieG on Mon Mar 25, 2013 11:08 am, edited 2 times in total.
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sandwhich
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by sandwhich » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:32 pm

Very good photos Stevie G, had almost forgotten what the area looked like, all has now gone even the York Way arches, last time I was there it was all but covered by several blocks of apartments and just a couple of original buildings with preservation orders on them to remind you of the old area.

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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by strang steel » Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:07 pm

Yes, more excellent photos.

Thanks.
John

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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by StevieG » Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:24 pm

sandwhich wrote: " .... all has now gone even the York Way arches, last time I was there it was all but covered by several blocks of apartments and just a couple of original buildings with preservation orders on them to remind you of the old area."
Indeed ; .... plus :
  • 1.the vaguely tubular CTRL bridge emerging from the steep ground beside, but at a lower level than, the south side of the NL viaduct and approximately passing through where the top of G&M box was, onto the curving embankment that curves round to St.Pancras

    2.the North London Incline realigned and re-levelled to start climbing as soon as it has diverged from the present-day Down Slow outside the southern portal of Copenhagen Tunnel's former Goods lines' bore

    3.and from roughly where the connections to the 'North Yard' left Coal Departure, the steeply falling trackless (at present) way curves and cuts down into the ground towards the south-west, soon meeting the NE portal of the tunnel destined to connect the Slow lines with the Thameslink line and St.Pancras 'low level' platforms.
Last edited by StevieG on Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Mickey
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by Mickey » Fri Mar 22, 2013 9:35 am

Some good photos there Stevie.

Mickey
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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by manna » Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:59 pm

G'Day Gents

A wonderful set of photo's, Stevie, I like the pic of what was behind G&MJ box, I never got into that part of the yard, so it's nice to see what was there.

Hard to believe that there was 3 or 4 trips a day to Temple Mills, even into the 70's and trips out to Palace Gates, Ashburton Grove etc. Glad in a way that I live so far away :(

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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by sandwhich » Sat Mar 23, 2013 11:23 am

In the April 2012 issue of Railway Modeller there is an article as regards the n gauge Copenhagen Fields model railway layout as it was in GNR and early LNER days and one of the photos is of the modelled Caledonian Goods & Coal Depot, all of the photos show that this is a very good model layout indeed.

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Re: Caledonian Road Goods Depot

Post by StevieG » Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:51 am

StevieG, on Thurs.21 Mar 2013, wrote:[ .... Managed it after all, somehow (I think/hope!) ] ..... continued from my earlier posts herein of 13:20 and 14:44 today .....

c1969/70 general view south from the North London line, of the area around Goods & Mineral Junction box. Amongst the many things that could be described; the line up behind the box is seen to have already become trackless, down its curving fall to pass through No.9 Arch of York Way road viaduct. And the gap between tracks seen left-of-centre had contained the Down Engine Line from KX Top Shed: Nos. 1 & 2 arches of the viaduct are also devoid of track in the background - The track immediately left of the gap, which mainly served as the former Up Engine Line, remains but only to pass through 'E' arch of the original viaduct section and serve the New Reception roads beyond.
scan.Color Goods&Min, (stitched images) KX Goods Yd Arr-Dep.lines, North Yd, Cal'l line & NL Incline from N.London Lines bdg (early morn'g) 800dpi (DeeprCntrst.jpg
And finally; - Courtesy of, and with full acknowledgement to/credit for capturing it, to Mr. F.Cheevers, then Modernisation Inspector,
this early-1970s view south, is of the south portal and beyond of Copenhagen Tunnel's Goods lines' bore, including Goods & Mineral box's prominent Up homes gantry: Photo taken from the rear of the brake van of one of the Electrification engineers' trains, as it headed away from their then temporary 'base' in the Goods yard.
(not scan'd) Colour Goods&Min from brake van in Copenh'n Tnl. FC.jpg
For those sufficiently interested, as a sort of continuation add-on to the photos in previous posts of mine herein (most recent one is above), four more photos of the area can be found in 'another place' - see posts of 16th & 18th Nov.2009, on 'page' 3 of 4 at the link below (unfortunately some others which were also available therein via 'Fotopic' and 'uk.geocities.com' links, are no longer viewable : Thread also includes a brief diversion to Huntingdon No.2) :
http://www.signalbox.org/forum/viewtopi ... l&start=30
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