Northern Heights

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StevieG
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Location: Near the GN main line in N.Herts.

Re: Northern Heights

Post by StevieG » Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:05 am

AndyRush wrote:
StevieG wrote:That Stevenage photo.: Has anyone got any 'gen.' on any date of minor track alteration at the north end of the station?

Why? .....
The only down lines track layout arrangement at Stevenage North 'box that I knew of, (apart from a Down Main-Up Fast crossover), had two running crossovers : Down Fast-Down Slow (Goods) just north of the road bridge IIRC, then the Down Slow-Down Main.
That required the four home signals (upper quadrants in every photo I've seen) that gazed down from on high, onto thousands of passing trains for several decades until the mid-'70s resignalling ; including the well-known (1930s?) event when one of the latest A4s + train, and a GN Single were photographed side-by-side just north of that bridge. But the photo here has only three Homes, of somersault type, and which, as I read them, only catered for a DF-DG crossing move.
So do we know when the second crossover was added?

Perhaps the pic is of a genuine GNR scene.
Lens of Sutton lists quote this view as 'pre grouping'

Don Anderson in the Great Northern Railway Society may be able to help regarding the altered track layout. He can be found at: don.m.anderson@bt.com

Regards

Andy

Andy
I'm sure he would Andy. Many thanks.
BZOH

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manna
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by manna » Sat Jun 19, 2010 10:43 pm

G'Day Gents
http://overground.doeth.net/heights/ This one is interesting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anHLOwH2HWU so is this one!

The youtube is the one I have been looking for, enjoy :lol:

manna
EDGWARE GN, Steam in the Suburbs.

PGBerrie
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by PGBerrie » Sun Jun 20, 2010 8:09 pm

Certainly did!

Peter

giner
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by giner » Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:58 am

Stevie G: I dug out a copy of the 1923 Ordnance Survey map I have of Stevenage from just south of Stevenage South box to about ten yards north of Julians Rd. bridge. Unfortunately, this falls short by several yards of the crossovers you mention. My own recollection is the same as yours. Looking at manna's photo, and the dress of the people on the platform, I get a strong hunch that it may be in Edwardian times. If someone knows when the three lower quadrants were changed to the four upper quadrants, that will help narrow it down.

The other famous photo that always shows up is the one taken from the Julians Road bridge of A4 4498 and the Stirling single at the down slow and fast platforms respectively.
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=h ... s%3Disch:1

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StevieG
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by StevieG » Tue Jun 22, 2010 12:29 am

Excellent, giner. Not sure I've seen that photo. Thanks v.m.
I was thinking I've seen one from further north, taken from the down side, with both locos and about a half coach north of the Julian's Road bridge.
BZOH

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manna
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by manna » Wed Jul 14, 2010 9:35 pm

G'Day Gents

Earlier in this thread I said that I had more pictures of the 'Northern Heights' but they were the wrong size for posting, well I've worked out how to redo them, to make them the right size 8) Hope you enjoy them.
manna
Attachments
MuswellHillStation1873.jpg
millhillthehalestation.jpg
thehale01.jpg
HighgateStationNew2Overview.jpg
EDGWARE GN, Steam in the Suburbs.

JeffB
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by JeffB » Sun Nov 28, 2010 6:36 pm

Just been catching up with some of the older postings on the sight and came across this one. When I went to KX topshed in 1958 we used to work goods trains up on these branches. Muswell Hill, Barnet, Edgware, Mill Hill East using the tube lines from Highgate. We would have an N2 tank engine and half a dozen assorted wagons on. We reversed out of Highbury Vale, near Arsenals Football ground, and went like hell past Clarence Yard, Western Sidings and up the hill north of Finsbury Park. Marvellous little branches, only the fact that you saw a tube train reminded you that you were in the middle of London. I remember one time in the 60s, a driver of one train returning to Highbury Vale lost control of the train north of Finsbury Park, he came sailing round the bend at the side of Finsbury Park carriage sidings, the crew jumped off and the N2 fell on its side, and ended up hanging over a bridge over Stroud Green Road, with a bit of luck, no body was seriously hurt. We were stood on Finsbury Park station north end platform 1, I think it was, because thats where the S.O.P was, watching.
When the Diesels where introduced we started using the Davey-Paxman engines. D8237 type engine. We used to pass a school between Mill Hill East and Edgware and when we got the Paxmans, all the kids would run to the wire fence and wave, not so with the mucky old steam engines. The good old days.

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thesignalman
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by thesignalman » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:03 pm

StevieG wrote:That Stevenage photo.: Has anyone got any 'gen.' on any date of minor track alteration at the north end of the station?
I don't know the exact date of the change, but the Down Goods to Main connection wasn't there in 1905. However, it is present on an LNER undated plan which I calculate to be about 1930. I think it is likely to be a GNR addition; the LNER was less inclined to spend money on such things. Sorry I can't be more specific.

John
"BX there, boy!"
Signalling history: https://www.signalbox.org/
Signalling and other railway photographs: https://433shop.co.uk/

Mickey

Re: Northern Heights

Post by Mickey » Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:35 pm

Deleted
Last edited by Mickey on Mon Apr 28, 2014 5:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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manna
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by manna » Mon Nov 29, 2010 9:16 pm

G'Day Gents

Nice to know that people are still interested in the Northern Heights, and thanks JeffB, a little insight to how it worked, and as Micky says what an asset it would be today and with so much of it still there!!!
Here's a few more pics

manna
Attachments
02%20Highgate%20to%20Edgeware%20line%20built%20c1867_JPG.jpg
Very rural, even though your only 10 miles from central London
23%20Gasworks%20Mill%20Hill%20East%201926_JPG.jpg
Mill Hill station is bottom right, several coal trains a day, went to the gasworks
EDGWARE GN, Steam in the Suburbs.

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thesignalman
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by thesignalman » Tue Nov 30, 2010 5:08 pm

JeffB wrote:Just been catching up with some of the older postings on the sight and came across this one. When I went to KX topshed in 1958 we used to work goods trains up on these branches. Muswell Hill, Barnet, Edgware, Mill Hill East using the tube lines from Highgate. We would have an N2 tank engine and half a dozen assorted wagons on.
I don't know if any coal ran to Barnet mid-week but there was definitely a trip on Sunday afternoons in the fifties - I always assumed the passenger service was too intense on a weekday. As a child I used to be called to the back of my grandparents' house in Totteridge (visiting for Sunday lunch) to look across the valley and watch it go by - both outbound and return. My grandfather named it The John Special because I was always keen to see it chuff past. My recollection was that this particular one was all coal and no other traffic but I don't really claim to remember detail from those days.

Perhaps you were chucking the coal on the very trains I was watching, Jeff!

John
"BX there, boy!"
Signalling history: https://www.signalbox.org/
Signalling and other railway photographs: https://433shop.co.uk/

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manna
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by manna » Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:15 pm

G'day Gents

This is the picture I've been looking for, for such a long time, in this pic you can see the layout of all the sidings at Edgware, It's so full of clutter, wagons everywhere, trucks being loaded straight off the wagons, a couple of builders yards, in or right next to the goods yard. The allotments, as you can see are full of fruit and vegies, but during the second world war two more siding were built on the allotments, but I would'nt mind betting some survived, I've never managed to find a post war picture.

If anyone is interested, there are a few pics of the Edgware branch, on the London Transport Museum site about the building of the 'Northern Line' to Edgware, There are aerial shots of the 'New" Tube station at Edgware with the old GN branch in the background.

manna
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Edgware sky view.jpg
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jwealleans
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by jwealleans » Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:27 pm

I'm sure that picture was published fairly recently in a magazine. It certainly rings a bell with me.

JeffB
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by JeffB » Wed Dec 01, 2010 12:15 am

Hi there. the coal trains for Barnet, and the other branches ran if and when there was anything to move, but most of the traffic from Highbury Vale was for Edgware. The wagons were carrying wooden type containers, all different sizes etc, dont know what was in them. If I remember rightly there was a DIY/put it together yourself type firm up there. They certainly had a lot of stuff delivered because we were running up there nearly everyday.
On the way back to Highbury we would probably have to wait at Mill Hill for a tube train to depart, it was single line so we would have to wait for the tube train to arrive, empty and refill with passengers, and then depart. And we would follow it on the tube lines to Highgate. It was only when I went up there that I realised how small the tube trains were, we could see right over the top of them.
It was a pity that the branches were closed to passenger traffic, but I dont think they generated enough revenue to keep them open, especially so with steam engines. Electrification would have been the answer, but back in the 40s and 50s would it have been cost effective. When the suburban services where electrified in the 70s, that would have been the time to start re-opening and electrifying the branches. I think BR missed an opportunity then.
I have enjoyed looking at these pictures, they have fetched back a lot of happy memories.

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manna
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Re: Northern Heights

Post by manna » Wed Dec 01, 2010 9:09 am

G'day Gents

Yes the picture of Edgware was in 'Model Rail' back in September (it helped me with my model of Edgware). Glad you liked the pics JeffB, unfortunately I never had the chance to work up the Northern Heights branches, as they were closed by the time I started at KX, except for the tube stock transfers, Ah well !!!!!!!!!

JeffB, just had a thought, other than the N2's and the Paxmans did any other locos work up the branch? such as class 24-26 and class 31 or maybe 08's ???
Thanks

manna
EDGWARE GN, Steam in the Suburbs.

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